We are in THIRD position on the ladder.

wash your mouth out

unbeliever!
witch!
heathen!

the only cut willie I know of is john bobbit's

look at our squad that is struggling. i dont care if where top or bottom, we cant win a ship with our squad so where in thbe same boat as every other team apart from melbourne and sydney.

if we cant win a ship this year or in the next few years then we need a change. spice things up a bit

Nothing can be said about Willys offence ability, but as a "leading" import in the comp his defensive efforts are poor. And even though we have won a championship with him i feel we got lucky that year as all the planets fell in line and we played some good ball at the right time, but im not sure you can build a championship team around a player like this.
Charles Thomas had far better numbers as far as consistency goes and was a much better defender, i feel we would have won atleast 3 games more with him, and if we had a Darnell, possible 5 games better.

As for the coach, as succesful as Phil has been, every coach has a used by date. I think the biggest problem at the moment is that we are still running the same motion stuff we did when we had an absolute wealth of talent and players that really suited that style of game. We now need a little more structure and Phil hasnt bothered to change that. The same goes for defence, us persisting with a match up zone, that doesnt give any accountability to players isnt going to work anymore. the final point about coaching change, is that Phil is a great coach of talent but doeant develop or recruit young players. Oscar and Brad hill should be further advanced than what they are but dont recieve the individual development they should and jacob has been lucky to have more national training which has helped him, but i know for a fact less and less of good adelaide talent want to play for the sixers because they know they wont be developed here, or recieve playing time due to the current structure of persisting with players that should be retiring.

Im sure all wont agree but when you think about it there is truth in every point.

for the record i havent been pleased with the sixers all season.

smyth doesnt embrace change. he's trying to win a ship with more or less the same squad as in a few years back. e.g why bring back nash, he's past it. and as much as i love reesy his best days a far and away behind him. why cant we get some fresh faces and fresh attitudes in our locker room. plus you cant win a ship without D so that rules out sixers.

Willie is signed. I do not think that the club could afford to cut him.

"Im sure all wont agree but when you think about it there is truth in every point."

-- Well Im thinking about it, and im not seeing a lot of truth.

"Charles Thomas had far better numbers as far as consistency goes and was a much better defender"

--There isnt any truth in this statement. At the best it is a complete exageration. Thomas was anything but consistent. Farley is averaging 19, 4 and 4 as a shooting guard who is not in the best form. The 4 assists/game by the way are equal best with Newley for a starting shooting guard in the NBL.

"..i feel we would have won atleast 3 games more with him, and if we had a Darnell, possible 5 games better."

--Oh this must be a 'truth' because its something you 'feel'.

"I think the biggest problem at the moment is that we are still running the same motion stuff we did when we had an absolute wealth of talent and players that really suited that style of game. We now need a little more structure and Phil hasnt bothered to change that."

-- Our problem hasnt been offense. 19 out of 26 games we have scored 100+ which is enough to win a game. Its only been our last 2 games that we have struggled offensively and failed to score 90. I would not throw a successful plan out the window because of out of sync offense in 2 games.

"The same goes for defence, us persisting with a match up zone, that doesnt give any accountability to players isnt going to work anymore."

--Once again, other than a handfull of games this year we have actually played good solid defense. There have just been 3 or 4 games in which the effort has not been there. This is not the fault of a matchup zone.

"the final point about coaching change, is that Phil is a great coach of talent but doeant develop or recruit young players. Oscar and Brad hill should be further advanced than what they are but dont recieve the individual development they should and jacob has been lucky to have more national training which has helped him"

-- I was only thinking the other day how well oscar and holmes had come along. I dont think you can credit a few boomers training sessions vs 4 years with Smyth as the reason for Holmes development.. thats just stupid. As for Oscar, averaging 11 and 5 off the bench with a superb 3pt% is excellent. Obviously he still needs to learn some inside moves to become a complete player... but geez.. how many complete players are in the league? Hill is only in his 2nd year.. Hes barely played 30 games. What do you expect out of him?? theres not many young players in the league that can have an impact with so little experience.

"but i know for a fact less and less of good adelaide talent want to play for the sixers because they know they wont be developed here, or recieve playing time due to the current structure of persisting with players that should be retiring."

-- Please, tell us all about this good Adelaide talent who are avoiding the Sixers and going elsewhere. And dont bring up Newley. Thats old news.

So to sum up... no i dont see much truth in anything you have said..

Kwest, why not bring up Newley? This could very well be one of the reasons he didn't consider Adelaide. Brushing it aside doesn't change the fact.

I don't think either sacking the coach or cutting players will solve anything, only put the sixers in a far worse situation.

Let's look at the bench influence on the recent games.

I don't know much about the road games but from what I've seen at the home games, the bench impact on games has fallen away dramatically.

With the 10 straight home wins this season, I'd say players such as Forman and even Rees were positively impacting on the games, Forman with sweet shooting and the big fella with solid defense with attitude. Where has that been lately?

Nash, at the start of the season was more attacking offensively but since injury has hesitated too much.

Hill has not seen as much time as I'd have liked to allow him to settle into the team structure rather thatn be too explosive and "young" with the ball. His explosive driving capability needs to be controlled and IMO he could develop a game that could be compared to D.Mee, able to create for teammates in any position and break down the opposition and inspire team and crowd.

Holmes needs to be consitent offensively but can play defense.

Cooper has dropped away a little, but when he was "performing" he was sharing tough opponents with Rees.

Farley is down and it shows, but i wouldn't say his numbers are too far down. He is now recieving much more attention, especially physically from each team.

Maher has tried to create for himself and the team, sometimes falling short. Recieves the same attention as Farley.

Dusty also appears to be in a form slump but still posts 20 and 10. Still not bad numbers.

Hambour....still a development player?

3pt and foul shooting are down and to still score between 90-100 pts is not too shabby.

One thing I do agree on from the original post is defense. What defense are the sixers playing? It is the kind that offensive teams love. What's ith the rotations and the switches. too often I see Maher or Farley on the post player. Not saying these guys can't play D but would prefer the bigger players to stay with their guys.

Offensively, IMO the sixers need more recognition, look for holmes to post up when he has the smaller guards on him, get Dusty to set the high screen and rol to the basket, that worked for his fist 1.5 seasons with adelaide.

Bite the bullet and scout new players to replace those who have seen their day or haven't performed consitently at that level for some time. Maybe scout particular positions to force some players to lift their game to NBL level or above.

Izzy- he was making it seem like there are many new examples. Id like to hear who they are. Everyone already knows about Newley

Goorjian is all over J Ingles as i have said in another post. He contacts young talent here and overseas to make sure they think about playing for the Kings.

smyth is sussing ray borner i bet.

My 2 cents worth...yes I know...you're all excited and the anticipation is killing you

If Phil Smyth and Steve Breheny (Because they are a package) were to be fired who would you replace them with? Scott Ninnis or Kevin Brooks and please don't say "Boy Gorg" because everyone knows he is not leaving Sydney. Phil and Steve should not be sacked and do not deserve the criticism that is being placed upon them.

Willy Farley and Dusty Rychart are expandable as imports that can be replaced however I would not be looking at any drastic changes yet as the side is sitting 3rd on the ladder and up until 2 weeks ago Holmes and Forman were having there best season, so development wise they are coming along nicely.

If there is any possibility to sign Luke S from the states and it required a slice of the salary pie to be given his way, Willy or Dusty would be the first ones that would have to go. The Sixers need a centre not more power forwards (Holmes and Forman could cover the 3 and 4 spot) with luck in the 5

Brett Maher and Willy Farley in the 1 and 2 spot

Oscar Forman and Jacob Holmes in the 3 and 4

Luck s in the 5 spot 5

David Cooper, Mark Nash, Brad Hill and one more to come off the bench.

I don't want to get rid of Dusty but in a sport where you have a limited number of players and a limited amount of money to spend on these players someone has to be expandable and unfortunate as it is Dusty or Willy would be that player.

Second-guess someone's answer? As Ms Hanson would politely say in parliament "Please Explain"

Only cutting down on the number of post via previous responses. Some smart arse clown would have said, "The Sixer should try and get Brian or well let try and get the best so that must be Brian"

Please don't quote me from previous post as it is hard to follow what your on about.

you don't need to lose either Farley or Dusty.

You need to eliminate Nash, Rees (sorry big fella) and Hambour.

Look to target a player like Big Luke S using funds made available from these 3, promote a young guard such as Gerlach and target another proven/quality player that can rotate through 2-3-4 spots easily.

Starters: Maher, Farley, Holmes, Dusty and Luke S

Bench: Hill, Forman, Cooper, Gerlach?, 2-3-4 man

Development: New Blood! offer clearly DOMINANT ABA players from previous season a training spot with flexibility to accomodate family/work responsibilities, kind of like the academy.

It has been said before that Maher is winding down, now is the time to look at groomong another star guard, and who better to tutor that player than Maher, ie Brad Hill.

Target players now to avoid what has happened previously with no signatures at all. Decide now who will be there next season and who WILL be let go.

maher and farley are not point guards. they are both pure shooting guards. that is one of the problems.

BLAZER, you would get around $100k from Nash, Rees and Hambour. Strip $50k of that for minimum for two guys, and you're left with $50k or less for Schenscher or whoever else - see the problem?

half agree. only half because Maher is fluent in both positions. He controls things, slows them down when needed and as we have seen, he hits most big shots.

I think the sixers main issue is still inside. The guards are producing 40 plus points per game with enough assists to generate another 20 pts making 60 pts with the guards alone. defensively the guards appear to be holding their own as individuals, but when they are broken down, the help seems to be struggling to know when to step up/switch etc.

Dusty is always quality, even on a downer. He consistently gets 20 and 10 or very close, usually against bigger, slightly more athletic and agile opponents.

Cooper and Holmes, obviously are quality players, but for mine, neither is consitent enough to be a threat to any opposition, and this is starting to be seen by opposing teams. Opposition pressure the main 3 Maher, Farley, Dusty and want the others to get the ball and let them shoot or dribble or even drive. They stop the ball getting cleanly to the main 3. That's all.
Thus usually force an ugly or unbalanced shot that the player doesn't really want to take. Leading to the other issue, no one wants to shoot the ball and always look to give it to either of the 2 starting guards and not utilising a screen set by Dusty. The 1st half season Dusty played for the sixers, he screened high, rolled and when fed the ball either propped for the 10 ft jumper or had the fake and step past opp for easy lay in. Opp didn't know how to counter this, no one managed to stop the Maher/Dusty or CT/Dusty combo.

Yes Isaac, I do see the problem.

Is it a requirement to have 10 contracted players?

Over the years of the sixers "development players" and even the 10th man, have they ever seen the court longer than 30 seconds for the season?

Don't forget Phil has been over rided and limited on his player choices by management above him for the last couple years.

Problem is that we currently have three of four key players in a bit of a slump at the moment, which can happen even with the best coaches and management - unfortunaltely we have multiple players in a slump.

Adelaide people are so picky - we often hear voter polls that put Dusty or Willie as one of the top imports, Maher as the best point guard, Maher and Willie as the best front court duo, Foreman best 6th Man, Holmes most improved and Phil as best coach. We have a lot of other teams envious ... yet we lose a couple of games and we want to fire them all.

Things could be worse - we could be like West Sydney playing a completely differnet team that the start of the year!

As much as I love Phil and his relaxed, free flowing coaching style, (I have played Senior District under a Phil type coach and a screaming, abusing coach like Boy-Gorg, and I have always found most people play better long term under a Phil type coach and have more loyalty to there teams), I would love to see him do a Malcolm Blight and blast Cooper or someone as a one off when they do something stoopid to put some fire in there belly.

End of the day - we are third on the ladder - so we will make the finals - which is another whole ball game again

As far as the development of Brad Hill - how can Phil get the blame for that....Hill has been at AIS for the last 4 years - isn't development what they are there for?

As for cutting imports...there are things called contracts people....even non imports...if the player is cut, the club has to pay out that contract, within salary cap constraints. The only player in the 6ers team that I am aware that is an exception is Nash, who has a mutually agreed performance/injury clause in his contract, allowing the 6ers to cut him mid season with no pay out should he be injured again.

Yes, Farley has defensive issues, I think everyone including Willie knows that. As someone else said, thats why you have other people in the squad, to counter for those deficiencies. Why do teams recruit guards, forwards and centres?? To cover for the lack of ability one of the other group has. Imagine the low rebound count in a team full of guards jacking up shots.

The team is sitting 3rd, just come off a bad slump, yes granted. Townsville had a bad slump 2 years ago (remember the "we wont shave till we win" then "we wont shave till we make the finals" creed they had) and yet still made the Grand Final. Slumps happen...it's how a team recovers from that slump thats important.

Take West Sydney for example. It was obvious Saturday night they are a group of players going through the motions. I didnt see anyone really step up to try and cover for the loss of Harvey and Horvath.

I think calling for sackings of the coach and imports is silly at best, and not what the team needs in terms of support.

Well sorreee...so he wasnt there for 4 years...still doesnt change the fact that they should have developed him, and not people saying that Phil hasnt developed him.

And I'm wondering when Luke said he wont come to Adelaide....I've never seen that in the media anywhere (I may have missed it).....I know he said no to coming to Sydney right now.

Seriously - How Many decent Players Come Out Of The AIS into the NBL?

The AIS is overrated and a joke - all decent players bypass it and head straight overseas, the AIS does help produce some good players - but a lot of people come out and don't even come close to NBL standard

On the topic of developing players/signing the best young talent there is no question that Smyth is far behind Goorjian in this area.

Goorjian is reportedly great at keeping contact with the top young talent while they are over in college giving him an edge when and/if they decide to play NBL. Good on him. Obviously if he out-works other coaches he deserves the success he obtains.

He already has an advantage due to being the Boomers coach but the fact he works harder than opposition coaches when it comes to recruiting young talent makes it even tougher for us to compete.

With no guarantee of court time (see Brad Hill this year or Jacob/Oscar over their first few seasons) it puts us in a position where we have to outbid opposition teams to sign our own young players.

Newley is the best example. I have no doubt in my mind that if he signed with Adelaide last year he would have been playing Brad Hill minutes backing up Maher and Farley instead of making the All-Star game, winning 6th man of the year and receiving NBA attention.

Adelaide is producing some international level quality players at the moment.

IE the following team wouldn't be too shabby in a few years time:

PG Hill
SG Newley
SF Holmes
PF Forman
C Schenscher

6 Kersten
7 Ingles
8 Seebohm
9 Dodman

All of the above are SA players but my guess is that we will be lucky to have 3 of the above 9 players on our roster in 5 years.

Its a question made more difficult by the fact that Farley and Dusty are quality imports who are looking to be 36ers for the next few years.

IE in my above list players such as Newley and Schenscher aren't planning on playing 500 game NBL careers.

Someone who has got to be talked about if and when the Sixers start recruiting is that new Holden Barina, as per that TV commercial (who said there was no basketball on free-to-air TV?).

That car has some serious game - and at an RRP of something like 12 or 13 grand, it's a cheap, cheap alternative.

bo - what abouts its points? if it was built at Elizabeth could we claim it as a rookie, keeping its points low.

I personally feel that the AIS has lost its spark in developing these guys into quality players if you look back over the years at the quality of players at the tute its getting less and less when i was there you could walk down the halls and see the names of past players there and they all turned into strong, tough committed b/ballers i only see that in a few of the modern day kids coming out of the AIS if they are not picked up in the NBL they only make average ABL players

Good call, Dr D. The positives from having a locally-made car on the team would be very positive indeed, including:

- difficult to guard, with very few defenders willing to take a charge from it

- able to get deep seals and be a prominent target in the post

- able to set killer, killer screens that would take days to get around

- quiet locker room presence unlikely to disrupt team harmony.

Although, from memory, it doesn't play much defense in the commercial. Questions the Sixers recruiters must consider:

- How well can it move laterally? Is it going to be able to contain, say, a Steven Black off the dribble?

- Can it jump? Rebounding could be an issue

- Absolute mayhem if it tries to flick back a loose ball going over the baseline at the end populated by the cheergirls.

from the scout report (the commercial on TV) i'm thinking Phil could use Barina in a pinch hitter role, in a similar way Phil Jackson used Steve Kerr at the bulls.

Come off the bench (may need to be reinforced) and hit a couple of quick buckets.

This could also save on mileage, netting us a better trade in.

C'mon Bo, you bring up the Barina's defense as something that Phil and Steve need to question...we have Farley on our team for god's sake!

may be you could be driving the Barina panther your always looking at new ways to cause more damage on the defensive end

Can I get a roo bar???

doenst anyone else agree that after being in the position for so long that phil has become stale and so have the sixers. cant we get some fresh ideas.

why should we wait until where near bottom and have an aged hack squad before we replace him. lets move ina fresh coach while weve still got a roster to work with

phil feels that hes under no pressure cause of his 3 year contract safety.

Astounding.

Smyth and Breheny are one of the best tandems in the NBL.
As some of you have expressed, just because there's a form slump there's no need to be trying to lay blame on someone.
Farley and Rychart are also one of the best tandems in the league. Yes, they have been in a form slump (and it shows on their faces) which is likely due to why the team is losing. Unfortunately Adelaide is a team where all cylinders need to be firing to get the best out of a game.

People shouldn't be so quick to criticise - where was all the criticism when the team was winning?
Support the team or shutup!