This aint it. He was good in patches but ultimately had a pretty underwhelming first stint at the 36ers.

"Seems we have the answer about Frank's"

Not really it seems like Franks is still holding onto the contract waiting for a payout.

CJ telling everyone he is going to the USA to get a PG yet Franks still hasn't been dealt with.

Wiley signed months ago as I mentioned. Boti mentioned it in April too.

Franks is on the press release as still being on the team

Very interesting

It's a worry if they haven't actually come to terms with Franks yet! To me, the only way signing Wiley makes sense is if they save a bunch of money that can then be invested in an elite guard. If they have to give Franks a sizable payout to get rid of him, then that might wipe out any savings. Should've just brought Franks back and told him to lose a few kgs. Would be a much better fit as a stretch 4 next to Humphries!

I don't love this but...why do people assume Wiley hasn’t or can’t have improved since the last stint? He was very young then. Pretty sure players can improve and grow. Give him a chance.
This is classic 6ers isn’t it. It’s gonna blow up in their face. Franks was disinterested last season now holds the whip hand.
Need it sorted because an elite import PG is compulsory for the team to be competitive.

Same old Sixers, did they think Franks would just walk, bring him back to honour his contract, if he doesn't then it’ll cost nothing. Is Wiley the answer, he hasn’t been great no matter where he’s played, but fancy signing him before the Franks contact has been sorted out.

Would people relax, Cleveland and Franks have the same agent. The club would have been in contact about both.
Wiley has been reported to have been signed for months, announced today after his contract in the BSN comp finished.
Franks will find somewhere to play if he hasn't already.

Read the article, Wiley has been signed for an energy guy, both at training and on game day. Something the 36ers have lacked for years. Plus he’s improved since last time he was here.

^ You'll need to get up to speed

I don't get this at all. Aside from the fact Wiley isn't anywhere near as good a player as Franks, is a poor rebounder and defender and now by signing him already Franks can ask for a big buyout.

I never bought the rumour of Wiley's return I thought it was too silly to be true yet here we are.

Personally I don't mind them playing together. Although Franks didn't want to come here post his Euro offer and played like it.

They complement each other skill wise

It's a fair bet that Humphries will miss a lot of games. Wiley wont be able to cover that C and PF slots by himself. Galloway hopefully evolves and gets consistent minutes. Jury out on Starling, he will be hit or miss at this level.

If Humphries stays healthy it gives the forward line great flexibility. Big if though.

This off season has not been impressive.

Clark, DJ , Franks, Sotto , Harris, Drmic has been turned into Cadee, Starling, Wiley , Humphries, Marshall

Downgrade at every position except Humphries - but Sotto would be playing every game so even that is a 50/50 call. Marshall has upside but Drmic is a known entity.

Shano, ever since Wiley was first rumoured, I had a look at his play in Puerto Rican league. He looked to have improved a little bit defensively and had a good game against Creek's team when they were playing small ball early in the season. His agility could be an asset in guarding mobile bigs if CJ is able to harness it, but he seems more interested in offence than defence.

But I haven’t seen any signs he can shoot reliably from the outside, he would rather slip screens looking to score than set them properly and he would rather get out on the break than box out secure the rebound. I didn’t see any sophisticated post moves either. He can bully smaller mismatches and shoot over them, but that’s about it.

Q Anon must have missed the NBL article where CJ just stated that the roster will be complete by the 20th and he's getting a guard that can close games out. So unless that’s an Aussie, Franks is gone.

Has Franks salary allowed us to get Wiley and Isaac? I’d rather have 2 than 1 tbh

I dare say DJ's salary has allowed us to get Humphries at least in part with some of it coming from Franks' salary. Wiley would be a lot cheaper than Franks but I think people forget Wiley hardly set the world on fire with us last time and that was four years ago too.

Aside from the big drop in offensive production vs Franks he's also a worse rebounder and not a good defender either plus we gave him a 2 year deal which I'm pretty sure means he can't be cut at any point during the season without his contract being paid out in full. Surely a 1 year deal would've been enough?

@NP I was the first on here to say Franks was gone. That was known within a week of the season finishing. However he hasn't said that he wont return in writing and so he is sill contracted. You know how good the 36ers are with paperwork.

Franks has played this very well.

The Wiley press release has Franks on the roster still.

My post above also reiterated that CJ has said multiple times he wants a guard. I also shared that Clark rejected the offer to return. Im well aware they are after a guard but also well aware , right now that they have 3 contracted imports.

They might have three imports under contract but we all know Wiley & Franks aren't going to be playing together hence CJ going to SL to recruit an import PG.

They can have four contracted imports but only three can be on the active roster.

@Zodiac..2nd year is a mutual one so essentially only signed for 1 year & therefore not guaranteed.

I know it's a mutual option that's not the point, I'm pretty sure because there is technically a second year it means he can't be cut at any point during the first year unless paid out in full though.

I remember when the Kings gave David Wear a 2 year deal and when he turned out to be a dud and Kings fans were calling for him to be cut someone on here said he couldn't be released because of that second year that JVG gave him even though it was team option or something and the Kings declined to pick it up.

Wiley probably cheaper than Franks so sixers putting their money into the pg

So if Franks stays, Wiley is back as is Cleveland, that makes Mccaron your point guard, three imports.
If they have the same agent, he's not looking after Sixers, he’s looking after his clients. Pay out time again for Sixers if import point guard is brought in. Franks is in a win, win situation.

Franks does hold the whip hand especially now after the Sixers stupidly signed Wiley before severing ties with Franks.

The other thing is that AC and Franks have the same agent I'm sure he doesn't like what the Sixers are doing here with one of his clients and I bet he steers AC away from the club after the season. The whole thing is bad on so many levels.

Going to be a really good test case of how much this league has improved.

Some strange calls in this thread. 'Will be a good test to see how the league has improved', how about the fact that the player could have possibly improved?

In response to Q Anon’s post, an interesting call on the roster being so much less impressive. Clark was pretty flakey as a scorer and bad defensively, cool guy though. DJ was a liability at both ends. Franks didn’t wanna be there so a plus for team culture. Sotto a good improving young player who could be NBA bound in a 2 way situation.
Then you’ve mentioned Harris who I loved but was limited at his size in what he will ever be and then Drmic who in all honestly I was pretty disappointed to lose.

Looks like we’ve gained some big boys who should be able to defend the paint a lot better than we have been since CJ came on board, plus hopefully a really good PG. I’m happy with this off-season so far pending a good 3rd import!

Agree with Basket.

Wiley will be cheaper than Frank's, freeing up extra $ to upgrade guard, which was a key issue last year.

DJ and probably Kai (makes business sense due to merchandise alone) also save large $ from player spend.

Given Humphries on board (if stays healthy) will sure up inside D which was other key issue last year, it makes sense to get a stud guard import.

Full squad not in place yet so can't rate whole off season, but

Humphries (healthy) > DJ as plays both ends
Stud PG import > Clark (assuming more $ available and potentially long term)
WileyCadee,starling,Marshall aren't key components but shouldn't lose too much for sotto, Harris and drmic (I'm a fan of last 2 with effort they bring everytime), plus Still have local big to come

Better rim protection by Humphries should free up Cleveland on perimeter D even more so another upgrade. Reports are Starlings D is high level aswell?

Concern is some other teams have upgraded significantly, but 36ers started from a long way back and are hopefully going in right direction

Some of post deleted itself

Wiley < Frank's skill wise, but better attitude wise and frees up $ to improve last year's weaknesses

they still spent a lot of money and probably don't have much to spend

McCarron Cleveland still taking a big portion of the spending

If you think franks is still "on the books" you'd have to be crazy, yes the press release says one thing but that’s not to say he hasn’t been told his contract has been terminated. I believe it has been terminated and they’re close to their guy at the PG spot, my concern is so they go for a pass first PG or a Jerome Randall type PG who bounces the air out of the ball and barely anyone else eats while he is on court

Import / Cadee / White
McCarron / Dech / Rasmussen
Cleveland / Marshall / Roxburgh
Willey / Galloway / Starling / Aliir
Humphries / Local

Imo depending on Humphries health and the import PG, that's a better top 10 players than last year easily.

Allowed three imports, while Franks is under contract he's got the gun at Sixers. He’s not leaving for free. If and when he does then sixers can contemplate getting an import point guard.

It seems Wiley bounced around a fair bit last season, starting the season in Japan where he struggled then spent most of the season playing for two different teams in the Greek second-tier league and then played in Puerto Rico during the offseason.

2022-23:

Shiga Lakestars - 7 games 7.9 ppg @ 51%, 5.9 rpg

NE Megaridas - 15 games 12.4 ppg @ 68%, 5.1 rpg

Ermis Schimatari - 13 games 7.7 ppg @ 49%, 6.2 rpg

Vagueros de Bayamon - 41 games 13.8 ppg @ 67%, 4.2 rpg

Signed for two seasons??? Are you kidding???

Dunkman, you're allowed three imports on the roster. Whether Franks will still be under contract come the start of the season or not is kind of irrelevant because he won't be playing for us. The only things it would effect is the owners bottom line and how much he's willing to spend on the roster this season if so.

Clearly the Sixers are betting Franks in the prime of his career doesn't want to spend a season sitting out, regardless if he's getting paid or not, because it will hurt his stock trying to get a good contract the following season.

What I'm trying to put across is that Franks has best bargaining position, I agree, he probably doesn’t want to sit out but at present he’s got a contract. He is in a position where he could make it difficult for the Sixers.
Wiley two years on what he’s shown the last few seasons, I certainly don’t understand it.

From a financial standpoint I agree. The Wiley signing is just bizarre other than for cost cutting reasons. The length of the deal if he can't be cut without being paid out plus now knowing he struggled in Japan and spent most of last season playing in Greece's Div 2 league is concerning, I didn't realise he had fallen off that much in his four years away.

@Zodiac...you're making a fair few assumptions. I've heard Franks came to the 36ers early and told them he wanted to explore other options and they mutually agreed out of his 2nd year.

Just because a journo had Franks name on a press release or the 36ers haven't released a statement doesn't mean the contracts in house have not had their i's dotted and t's crossed in regards to their termination.

^^^^
Why would they not announce it if Franks has been released, more money going out.

Tornado, not sure why you're mentioning me I never said anything about a press release, I haven't even read it yet?

But rest assured if Franks was mentioned as still under contract in the press release then he is, the NBL have to sign off on everything re: signings and terminations.

"spent most of last season playing in Greece's Div 2 league is concerning, I didn't realise he had fallen off that much in his four years away."

That's not necessarily how it works. It's not all the best imports in Div 1 and then the next best in Div 2. A player's agent will often take the best financial offer, and some Div 2 teams throw big money at imports.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not at all convinced this is a good signing, but the league someone was recently playing in doesn't always tell much of a story.

It usually does though especially after playing so poorly in Japan.

Jacob Wiley is a really overrated player. He was never good in Europe. Somehow he manages to keep getting good contracts though.

He's a very efficient finisher, good athlete and a good offensive rebounder. He has traits that teams seek. The question for Adelaide is has he improved his ability to defend ball-screens?

If he can do that well, he helps them fill what's been a weakness for most seasons over the past decade. If he can't, more of the same awaits.

Wiley two years on what he's shown the last few seasons, I certainly don’t understand it.

managed*

tohi smith milner is my guess as local backup

Saint, I hope you're wrong. If he wasn’t quite good enough for the NBL at umpteen other teams then why would it be any different at Sixers?

https://nbl.com.au/news/a-frank-exchange-adelaide-s-import-issue

Some higher level background to the Franks situation in the Olgun article.

Why they are agreeing to let Franks dictate the pace here is beyond me.

The only thing I can think of is they must be trying to keep the agent onside. They have already blackballed one significant agent.

Q Anon how do you think they should handle it? The guy has a contract, the ball is in his court

You dont sign someone without having a spot for them.

but they did have a spot for Wiley. They just don't have a spot for another import. They were expecting Franks to be picked up but unfortunately that fell through.


Mathew do you still think you are right on this one?

Point taken

They dont have a spot for Franks and Wiley

What's CJ doing at Summer League apart from getting fan photos with ex NBA players?

Just sign Keifer Sykes and get on with it.

why keifer sykes?

I just don't understand what the rush was to sign Wiley? He was playing in the Greek second-tier league last season so what if you miss out on a guy like him. I can only think it was an attempt to strongarm Franks into opting out.

why keifer sykes?

I said two weeks ago that Mccaron would be the point guard, the Russian war has hurt wages, still very reasonable but stagnant. Wasn't Franks going to try get to Russia last season, he could have second thoughts and his last form doesn’t rank for the big dollar euro deal. He’s waiting to see where it all goes.
In saying all the above, Franks still got the best hand but I think he’ll still be gone. If not lol at Sixers.

but they did have a spot for Wiley. They just don't have a spot for another import. They were expecting Franks to be picked up but unfortunately that fell through.

Franks could demand a pay out if CJ comes home with a point guard. His agent has been in charge of circumstances since day one. It would allow Franks to take unders in Europe.

^ correct

36ers have messed this up

The owner will be getting his wallet out again unnecessarily.

This is why the NBL is messed up compared to other international leagues. Just open the import sports to 4 if necessary.

It's the National Basketball League not the Australian-New Zealand Basketball League.

What do you think "National" means?

I'm not sure this is an argument for four imports. Who forced the Sixers to give Franks a 2 year deal? Or to sign Wiley before Franks had opted out? You can't protect team owners from their own stupidity.

Sixers are a complete mess, if they had a second Adelaide side in the NBL I would jump ships so quick. 36ers have been poor since 2018/19.

Management need a good hard at themselves.
Need to sort this asap if they want a one.

It was more fun when we could blame JVG. :::)))))

JVG's legacy lives on - he obviously taught them well. LOL

Sixers management was shit pre- and still is post-JVG, he was just the cherry on top of it all for a while.

Franks can't demand a payout just because Adelaide sign three other imports. To get his money he'd have to stick around and meet all his contractual obligations. This is a case of who will blink first.

I mean the Ball is Franks court Adelaide won't terminate his contract because for obvious reasons

Whats the worse scenario?

Sixers stick with Franks, Cleveland and Wiley with Franks sulking the way through the season.

Or Sixers are on Franks' timeline and he opts to leave at at an inconvenient time to find a replacement?

Sixers will sign another import. Is Franks willing to sit out a season? Who will call the other's bluff?

He will find a club we just don't want it to screw with our PG signing timeline.

I wonder if we are prepared to go funky?

C Humphries
F Wiley
F Franks
G Cleveland
G McCarron

Wouldn’t that be a sight

I doubt they'll wait re the other signing.

i thought the point Olgun was making was that the 36ers cannot sign a 4th import to a NBL League ratified contract.

All contracts have to ratified by the NBL Head Office, and they are not going to accept the contract while Adelaide already has 3 imports signed. Not %100 sure of the legalities, but i thought that was what Olgun was implying.
what Manager is going to sign his player to a club knowing that the contract would not be acknowledged and accepted by the governing body.

"To get his money he'd have to stick around and meet all his contractual obligations."

Sure but Sixers would have to meet their contractual obligations which would probably be to have him on the roster

Franks = show me the money.

Could Wiley have a contract that relays on Franks being gone, he is supposedly signed for two seasons.

Long story short, its highly likely Franks is getting paid by the 36ers this season.
4 scenarios are:

1) They release him , he gets paid out the season or a reduced negotiated fee
2) He stays and plays
3) He stays, he doesn't play and still gets his full income.
4) He gets a higher paying gig and asks to be released formally

All scenarios have risk and cost to the 36ers. All this nonsense because he said he wasn't coming back verbally.

Sure but Sixers would have to meet their contractual obligations which would probably be to have him on the roster

Yea I cant see a way where it wont cost the 36ers some money.

I could be wrong but I thought most contracts have an offset clause, so the 36ers would only have to pay the difference between his 36ers contract and his new contract if its lower.

If this is the case, I think the 36ers should just cut him, which will force him to find another job, which will then reduce the amount they have to pay him and also open up the spot for the import PG.

I hope the lesson learnt here is dont give imports 2 year deals before they have payed for you, or atleast make it a team option so you can move them on if you wish, it seems we got too desperate to sign Franks and gave him too much leverage especially after his poor attitude last season.

Wiley just signed for two years, Cleveland also had two years, sometimes it works out, other times it doesn't.

I can't understand these two year deals Adelaide are giving imports.

The Cleveland deal is pretty safe, but imports are an important way NBL teams can rejuvenate a roster.

Why is it necessary to give Wiley a two year deal?

The wording of the " signed for 2 years " is poor

It's 1 plus an option of the 3 combinations team , player or mutual

AC and Franks did not have 2 year deals.

No way you would give an import a guaranteed 2 year deal. Import blows a knee in year 1 you have to pay them for year 2.

There are exceptions like Cotton where the Cats have a vested interest in him becoming a citizen so would take the risk

Harvey at Illawarra got a 3 year deal so it happens

Q Anon, so what is the issue with Franks then for us dummies? Was it a player option?

Sebastian, yes there are exceptions where the player is a club and fan favourite, but that can also backfire.

Obviously Perth locking up cotton is the right move.

I just don't understand why it would be necessary to get players like Wiley.

There is no such thing as a guaranteed roster spot. Remember last season when United had told Caroline they were going to replace him and he remained sitting on the bench not playing until they secured Lee?

It's pretty annoying because Franks' attitude last year was clearly a massive detriment to the team. He seems like a pretty pathetic dude.

Franks has a player option. You could say that when the 36ers say we have given player x a 2 year deal it's not incorrect. The player has the 2 year deal not the club. They want to change it they need to pay out or get the agent to find the player a better deal to go to.

He verbally opted out and the 36ers acted in good faith on that.

As he hasn't been able to get a deal better than what he has with Adelaide he is now holding on.

My guess is he will get paid a settlement fee. Typically players will take lesser payment to free them of a deal and get the release they need to sign elsewhere.

36ers could arguably say they are in dispute and force Franks too sit out whilst FIBA decision the situation. That works against the player normally as they cant play anywhere else whilst awaiting a decision.

Im not familiar enough with overseas leagues to know when those windows open and close to signings. I recall he was pretty happy not to come to Adelaide as he thought he had a Euro deal.

Is this only a concern to fans because it might impact spending on last import, or is just a blow to the owner?

It's concerning because I might have to watch Franks and Wiley in the same lineup
And I really don’t want to watch either of them let alone both of them
However
It’s of major concern because it’s blocking the coaches ability to recruit a high quality guard at Summer League

Euro market is in full swing now and in most leagues they make changes till about a month before finals. It cut throat and contracts have outs in them for both players and clubs.

So in the AFL Brody Grundy is being paid by Collingwood to play for Melbourne... is there a chance that say Perth(got import spots available) decide to have Franks as an import and Adelaide pay part of his wages?

Yes

This has happened in the past. Oscar Forman was paid by New Zealand by Illawarra. Rod Grizzard came to Adelaide from Melbourne after being released. I'm sure there are other examples.

Has Franks triggered his option or just not opted out yet?

If he just hasn't triggered then surely there is a cut off date to do this, and it wouldn't be this close to the season.

If he has triggered, then I assume it is now up to the club to release him if he finds a better deal? Adelaide could choose not to release him (unless he has out clauses for that league) if he wants to play hardball

Obviously Adelaide want to release him, but they still hold some bargaining power because they could threaten to force him to stay and maybe sit the season out.

The other thing in play is Adelaide won't want to hurt their reputation further regarding player negotiations (think Mitch Creek), which will make it harder to recruit players in the future, particularly if his agent also manages Cleveland, who I think can potentially be a franchise player for a long time if he wants

Agree Adelaide will still try to find a stud guard and expect Franks will go one way or another, hopefully with both sides not damaging their reputation

Peter
Franks deal was two year with no option ( team player or mutual ) it has an NBA / Europe out clause though

Franks and Cleveland share same agent they wanted to play together wherever in the NBL I remember Liam Santamaria saying that

Ok thanks, was basing the player option theory on a few posts above.

The same theory stands though that neither party want Franks to be in Adelaide next year, but both parties need to agree to cancel contract.

Franks Euro out clause gives him more power but if he tries to double dip and force Adelaide's hand for a payout, then sign with another club, he runs the risk of them sitting him, which would hurt reputation for both sides.

It's poor form from Franks though to force the club to keep him on the roster when he has every intention of leaving as soon as he finds another club, or sulking and being a bit of a cancer around the club if he doesnt.

Adelaide put themselves in the position, but it's not a great character reference for Franks.

Adelaide really have no choice but to sign an import PG and do whatever is needed to get rid of or sit Frank$

Peter lets say you told an employer you were going to find other work but then couldn't find any. Would you still cancel the contract that probably pays $300k+? I don't think most people especially athletes with limited time to make money would. It is what it is unfortunately

I'm pretty sure there was an article last year that said Franks' 2 year deal was for $450k+ per year. At that kind of money, his attempts to get out of his contract before he even arrived and his reluctance to get out second gear last season you can see why the Sixers would want him to walk away from his contract.

Sixers should've waited on Franks before signing Wiley.

Worst case you keep Franks and have an ok guard instead of a good guard and Wiley.

CJ update on the import logjam with Franks & Wiley:

"I'll find out in the next 24 to 48 hours if that’s all confirmed," Bruton said of a Franks move away from the club.

“As of right now, he’s planning on finding other opportunities overseas ... I heard it’s getting close to done.

“He has our blessings as he was open and honest about what he wanted to do and where he wants to go.”

Franks to Japan looks very close.