Wish the Melbourne/Perth game was the televised one - looks set to be one of the games of the season! Their match up earlier in the season went to OT and I wouldn't be surprised if this weekend did too, or if not very very close. If the Lynx can sweep their weekend I can't see them dropping another game for the rest of the regular season.

You'd have to think that if Adelaide can't sweep their weekend it just about knocks them out of reach for that 4th spot.

Bendigo surely has to have a chance at winning against Canberra. Jarry should still be out from last weeks head knock.

Thoughts?

They're a chance, yeah, but I still like the Caps. Even without Jarry they still look a balanced team to me, and much deeper than the Spirit, who are highly reliant on their starters (and Laney in particular). More has to go right for Bendigo to win.
If you believe in the Spirit they're paying $3

"Bendigo surely has to have a chance ...
Thoughts?"

http://www.hoops.com.au/forum/42368-betting-nbl-round-10-wnbl-round-11/#p661632

Rangers v Flames live stream tonight:

https://www.foxsports.com.au/live

Anyone know why Ezi didn't get any minutes last night against Bendigo? She was listed on their live stats bench but had 0 minutes next to her name.

"Anyone know why Ezi didn't get any minutes last night against Bendigo?"

She wasn't at the stadium. I know it doesn't help much, but can only assume carrying an injury of some sort.

Definitely looked like a scrappy game. Certainly can expect that from the Rangers given all their injuries, but worrying signs for Sydney if they expect to defend their title.

High school grad! So there's more to life than sport? I'd do my own wedding ceromony via skype from the dressing sheds rather than miss a game.

Oh well then a graduation is a far more positive reason for missing the game than I was expecting!!

I agree, Sydney are worrying - not a great look when four of their starters get 5 TOs each. If they stay in that 4th spot I can't see them beating Perth, Townsville or Melbourne in the three game semi final series. Even more so when those games are 3 in 6 days or something ridiculous like that, the way they consistently play their starters for 35+ makes me question their ability to win if it went to 3.

Wish Perth had a stream, Lightning up by 4 at HT. Is the streak dead?

Williams on fire with 19 already but Whitcomb/Kunek awful from the field atm. Bishop and Seekamp combining really well for Adelaide.

Adelaide legit outplaying Perth, but Williams has been ridiculous.
It's like she decided that every quarter was the 4th.
Final scoreline really unfair

Yeah it obviously wasn't a 17pt game but in the blink of an eye Perth are doing that to teams (plus it was all about bench v bench late). Worrying signs too that Williams FG% dropped from 81% to 76% in that last quarter.

What a game by Williams!! Adelaide would've been absolutely blown out of the water there if Whitcomb and Kunek had've shot at their usual clips.

Waves2Lynx, never doubt the streak! Being down by 4 at the half is nothing compared to what they've been down and come back from the past few weeks.

Does fatigue factor stop them Sunday? I'm no so sure it will.

There's no way it doesn't slow us down, playing a tough game and then flying cross country to play a fresh team.
On the plus side there's plenty of potential improvement in Kunek & Whitcomb.
Burton playing 5 minutes in the 1st half tonight and then nothing after half time despite being very needed doesn't seem like a good sign for the state of her ankle.

Interestingly it was a similar scenario for the Rd3 OT game, with Perth on the one day travel break, albeit from a soft home win over Bendigo. Melbourne was the rested team but were minus O'Hea, Deuver & Tomlinson. Melbourne obviously well placed but I'm not sure I'll be rushing into any short odds out of respect for the unit Perth have become - reminds me a lot Flames last season, who kept pulling out results no matter what, including 4-0 when backed up next day - traveled interstate for three of those.

No one can't stop Perths offensive! No ones kept them under 80 pts in recent times other than the Rangers.

And I'd say rangers are done and dusted, their worst year for many many years , if not ever.......combination of poor selection, bad timing fir injuries and some bad coaching decisions.........hope they put some new blood at the helm for next season, though not sure who is left of any caliber to coach at this level

Williams 41pts in 31 minutes...Who was guarding her from Adelaide?

rangers will miss finals this year due to major injuries...not sure that's the coaches fault though. cavanagh has got them still playing hard which is a good reflection on the coach.

Holy shit Williams that was insane! In form WNBA starter running rings around a solid team here.

Haha Melb Fan doubting the streak, especially away from home, is why I'm on the bottom of the tipping :P

Ridiculous to call for the coach's head after her team has been smashed by serious injuries like this. Nothing wrong with Larissa's coaching IMO.

Williams 41pts in 31 minutes...Who was guarding her from Adelaide?

Had Sara Blicavs not been injured I'd have them right up there fighting with Adelaide and Sydney for that final playoffs spot. It's pretty rough to call for Larissa's head when she's been down her best player (IMO) for the better part of the season and then down an additional two starters over the past three games. Most if not all teams have been down a starter at least once this season, but I don't recall any team being down two or more at any one time apart from Dandenong.

In terms of Melbourne vs Perth, I just can't see how the Boomers are going to make up that 17 point gap between their average ppg - because I certainly can't see the Lynx scoring sub 70 points. I'd expect Liz to go for around 20-30 points, O'Hea 10-15, but who else will stand up? No other players have been reliable enough for them this season in terms of scoring. I think to beat Perth they really need more from Cole, Garrick and Smart off the bench. I'm tipping the streak to continue for at least another week given they play again in Perth next weekend as well.

Bec Cole is a player flying under the radar at present, IMO. It seems to have taken a season and half to break out of her injury setback but I thought she's greatly impressed in last few games.

Speaking on Coaches heads, I think Bendigo and Canberra have under performed and questions should be asked.

Certainly agree re coaches - Goriss certainly has a few worries IMO - their roster is a lot better than their record suggests which is disappointing. On Pritchard, I think it's more a recruitment issue - I feel Bendigo probably have more trouble recruiting those big marquee imports like Williams/Taylor because of their location and/or resources. Doesn't help that they lost Griffin either, but I can't really see a coaching change doing much to change their fortunes.

Cole definitely has the potential to step it up even further, I'd like to see her continue that form of late against a top 4 calibre side though - her better games have been against the likes of Bendigo and Canberra thus far. She's one IMO who could potentially benefit from a change of scenery, just about her whole career has been under Molloy so I think a different game style/input could potentially elevate her up to the cusp of Opals squads.

I think health has been Cole's main problem, not location or coaching. I know it's cool here to blame Molloy for everything negative about the Boomers, but Bec was very much pushing herself into the Opals squad conversation (IMO at least) prior to doing her ACL a few years ago. Now she has worked herself back and is playing pretty effectively again, seemingly with confidence on the up, all from within the Boomers system. It's great to see.

Banham ... yeah, huge college reputation, but yet to bring that to a higher level. I thought she was a savvy recruit by Bendigo, because she's the type of player who could potentially do a Griffin and elevate her game here with the increased opportunity. It hasn't worked out to the best case scenario though. She's still a dangerous player to have on the floor, but not a go-to star. No shame in that. The WNBL is a strong league these days.

Banham has at times lived up to the hype around her, I definitely wouldn't call her recruitment a bad one by any stretch. I'm just talking about those WNBA and/or internationally established players - Williams, Pondexter, Palau, or Montgomery for example.

perth without there starting centre beats lightning on the boards by 39-27. please explain?

They say change is as good as a holiday, and I'd tend to agree with that sentiment for the most part. Not necessarily anything against Molloy, just sometimes that challenge of a change of club can be beneficial for players, not just in basketball but in other sporting codes as well. Just look at the changes in Steph Blicavs when she went from Townsville to Dandenong, O'Hea from Bulleen to Dandenong, Batkovic from Sydney to Townsville for example.

Injuries definitely haven't been a friend of Cole's but hopefully now she's got her confidence back those issues will be a thing of the past. She definitely has high potential and the work ethic to get there if she can stay healthy.

i think Anderson's coaching record defends her from this season full of injuries. Losing 2 opals and an import will deplete any team. I think the current roster fully fit with maybe one or two upgrades will be challengers next season.

Is that our top 4 now? Not impossible that Adelaide can make it but you'd think they have to win every game from here on out. Canberra game effectively an elimination match.

Less than 3 minutes in and Dowe already has 2 PFs & Standish 1. Eeks.

One quarter in the books and Liz already has 10 & 5,
but Sami has 14 & 4 assists, and Courtney 8 & 4 steals.
Spewing that it's not being streamed.

46-51 at halftime. I don't think that's going to be enough once foul trouble + fatigue start to bite.
Liz already respectable full game numbers of 22 & 9
32 points @ 14/21 for Courtmi Willcomb

How about a team that manages to play a half of basketball, and their leading rebounder has 1 rebound.
Adelaide do you want that 4th spot or not?

This game sounds epic. Been keeping an eye on the stats and it has been basket-for-basket all through the 4th.

Holy shit .. they did it.

I thought the Rangers were very competitive in Townsville. They won the second half with a depleted team and had all their 3 bigs on 3 fouls before halftime. I guess haters gonna hate.....even if they don't make sense!

Adelaide lose to Capitals without Nat Hurst! The Lightning won't make finals now!

Sounds like Larissa was frustrated at the referees. This wouldn't be the 1st or last time a coach will comment on the refs. I believe there is a separate thread commenting on how poor the refs have been this season?

> #661983

...and they're gone.

Put me down for a Courtmi Willcomb jersey.

Lynx v Boomers rematch is the TV game next week.

I think everyone's got the point that you don't like Larissa. Let's move on from the Rangers and focus on who's gonna make the Top 4??

Perth, Townsville, Boomers, Sydney will be the Top 4.

Boomers vs Perth in the GF and think Perth will win it in 3.

What a game b/w Melbourne & Perth. It had everything,
great shooting by Perth, big game from Liz (and no tantrums). The two W's shot very well again, instead of Kunek shooting well it was the other K, Kayla.
It must have been pleasing for Kunek too nail those free throws after leaving Melbourne last season and moving to a coach who KNOWS how to develop a player.

Can some one tell me what player has Guy developed into a better player?

There isn't one.

Perth have shown small ball is the way to win in this condensed WNBL season.

Andy Stewart is a heck of a coach IMO. I don't think he gets enough credit for what he does over here in terms of getting maximum production out of his players. I love his demeanour too, both with his players and the refs. No unnecessary carry-on that infects the playing group, just delivers his messages.

We all knew from the start that Perth's backcourt would be elite, but 2 players don't win basketball games on their own. The way we've managed to not get destroyed by all the quality bigs in the league this season is again a credit to Andy, and to the collection of undersized players who have bought 100% into a system of working for each other.
By rights the condensed season should have hurt Perth more than anyone, with our distance away, our lack of depth, and the tempo we're forced to play at to compensate for lack of size. I still don't quite get how we're at the top of the ladder right now, but the collective group attitude is probably the #1 factor underpinning it.

Perth have also been lucky to play alot of teams when undermanned during the season which has helped them. But full credit to them just the same.

It's true - we've caught quite a few teams at an unfortunate time, health-wise.
With the number of injuries around the league this season I know we're not alone with that, but it feels like we've got more than our fair share of it.

I believe you are right on target, Luuuc. Teams can recruit stars and coaches can take as many whiteboard & training drill sessions as they want but comradery & culture is the essential ingredient. Sydney Uni Flames, Western Bulldogs, Richmond but not Melbourne United, are all testimony to that lately.

This is why Melbourne hasn't gone anywhere under Guy's coaching.
Just look at his record, always finishing in the bottom 4. Yet gets another 3 years.
Who has the answer?

Has there been a change to how finishing positions are determined? Is it still season splits or is it now percentage?

Not because of his coaching, he has had very good teams in the past and not delivered.
Last season he lost at least 5 games because of his subbing.
This year he has a 6.8 centre who is unstoppable.
They should win.
But have all the players bought in?

I hope it's still season splits, seeing as every team has a 3-game series against every other team this season. Makes it perfect for that system.
I know the NBL tweaked their system but I don't recall hearing anything about the WNBL changing.

I believe it is splits deciding the final placings - though the WNBL site ladder had teams ranked on percentage when teams were on equal records.

In terms of the top 4, Perth have splits over them all bar Melbourne which will be decided on Saturday, Melbourne has no splits over top 4 teams, Townsville has the split over Melbourne and is tied with Sydney (to be decided on the 29th), and Sydney has the split over Melbourne. If Adelaide were to sneak in they do have the split over Sydney but they really do need other results to go in their favour now. Shout out to Helen (@hoopshots) /BasketCase for the split sheet - absolute legend for putting that together.

Definitely is still splits - the below taken from the official 17/18 media guide;

"The order of the ladder will be determined by each team's winning percentage. If teams are tied at the end of the
season, ties will be broken by the head-to-head record of tied teams."

Thanks Melb Fan. I'd spent the morning tabulating season splits then noticed how the ladder is being shown.

Perth still need a win for certain top. The other three is tight to predict, with Townsville or Sydney most likely for second. Melbourne could win all three but would still need good fortune to get second (teams like Canberra & Bendigo should have some extra barrackers there).

If Townsville snare second then third will still be a good prize IMO, because Townsville will be vulnerable even with two at home.

I penned my own Outright market today and even at 2.75 with some bookmakers I believe Perth are decent overs. The other four are a bit or a lot too short IMO.

Bookmakers best odds:

Perth Lynx
3.10
Sydney Uni Flames
4.33
Melbourne Boomers
4.00
Townsville Fire
5.00
Adelaide Lightning
34.00

Whilst I agree with the odds, is every teams defence or offence that bad that they can't expose Perth's weaknesses?

Townsville have to most talent out of any team and should win it! But their high credential imports don't fire year in year out??

Perths strengths in Williams and Whitcomb are too hard to stop for teams, let alone worry about exposing Perths weakness!

It should be a great finals series, any of the four teams can win it if it all clicks for them. Perth have to be favourites and Sydney the shakiest. A grand finals series like the game last week (and for next week too) would be fun to watch.

I think the long term prognosis was she's due back by the end of the home & away?? Not sure what the latest update is.

Perth deserve to be favourites atm, but it really is an open contest IMO. As a jump-shooting team with no Plan B, we will always be vulnerable.


On the other hand, when we're nailing tough shots at 76% accuracy, we are very hard to keep up with!

Bendigo supporter here...

If any coaches need to be worried, definitely Simon. Players aren't happy, supporters aren't happy and club not happy. Yes Griffin is out... though a key player, that is one player. He has been there for three years, had greater depth in some of those seasons and still no finals appearances. Yes location etc may be a challenge for them at times, but previous coaches had that issue and managed to get the best (and more) from the players!! And championships!!
If it weren't for Sion, the likes of Snell and Wilson would still be there - big game players in this league ad experienced. Snell all but said this plainly in her Herald Sun article. Players like that would have bridged the hole missing from Griffin. He and his agenda is ruining the club. Needs to go! Check out Bendigo Spirit army page if you want to see how the supporters feel about him!

Is it true that Tess Lavey lives in Bendigo?

I believe she may have a house there but hasn't lived there since she left spirit and went to Perth. Originally from swan hill. Another one they nolonger have but she never played under Simon.

Would not know where she lives though

Lavey left for Perth because Bendigo didn't play her, that was under Harrower, players will only sit for so long, coaches need to understand that, different when they are teenagers and development players, but they can’t stay like that for years on end waiting for injuries to give them a chance, Lavey only lasted one year in Perth , now signed two yrs with Rangers.
Can players get out of contracts ?

Bendigo could have used her this season

I suppose sitting on the bottom of the ladder and losing by 30pts each week isn't much to smile about?

What do we think of the MVP race? There's four clear favourites - Cambage, Williams, Batkovic, Taylor (makes team of the year easier to figure out).

I think out of those the most likely winner to be in the end Cambage on current form or Williams if she's able to carry Perth to the finals and the league doesn't want the baggage of giving it to Liz.

The other two can still get it, Batkovic has still been playing well and Taylor's been injured I just think they're further behind and will need to carry their teams more come finals.

Cambage will win MVP. Without her, Boomers are a bottom 2 team!

How is the WNBL MVP determined?

So does that mean a coach can distribute the 10 as they please? Eg. 5-4-1 or 2-2-2-2-2, etc.

Lavey apparently is best mates with Sara B.

The 2014/15 Bendigo roster was as follows. Sara was starting (I think?). Unfortunatly the four young guns (+Penaluna) moved on after that season:

Kelsey Griffin
Belinda Snell
Gabrielle Richards
Sara Blicavs
Kristi Harrower (retired mid season)
Chelsea Aubry
Madeleine Garrick
Kelly Wilson
Heather Oliver
Tessa Lavey
Jane Chalmers
Elyse Penaluna
Tayla Roberts
Andrea Wilson

I'm fairly certain Lavey lives with Sara & Tayla Roberts in Michele Timms house - one of them said it ages ago on the WNBL show.

In terms of the MVP race, I feel Liz will get it - though I think Williams is the more talented/deserving player. Who from the Boomers will be pinching votes from her? Maybe O'Hea, but not enough to really put a dent in her chances. Williams is competing with Whitcomb for votes, and I wouldn't be surprised if Kunek and Standish pinched a few from them here and there. Same deal with Taylor, she's probably going to have quite a few votes pinched by Snell, Ebzery, Wilson and even Hamson at times. If it were decided on those coaches votes, then in order I'd say Cambage, Batkovic, Williams, Taylor then Whitcomb coming in at 5th.

On the Bendigo discussion earlier, their SEABL team has signed Tessari, Payne, Karaitiana, Hurst, Wild & Jess Rennie for the upcoming season. https://twitter.com/joelbpeterson/status/942917452244992000

Ah yeah if it's a voting system rather than a panel of judges than agree that favours Liz as Williams/Whitcomb will trade points. In the future I'd like to see more than 8 coaches decide each game. Include the refs, at least one member of the media maybe too. Counters bias of all groups that way.

The All-Star team seems straight forward, really only that 5th spot that should have any contention but agree it's Whitcomb's as thing stand now. Players like Bishop, Snell, O'Hea, George, Cummings the next tier and one of them may sneak in.

Oh forgot to mention but great video Luuc, thanks! Geez CW makes our league look pedestrian (which is what you'd want from a regular WNBA starter and Team USA member).

Agree, I was surprised (if it is true that is) that coaches votes decide the league MVP - I'm sure most if not all would vote fairly but as suggested above re Townsville/Suzy there for sure could potentially be personal agendas going on there. I'd have thought refs would have some sort of say like they do in the Brownlow, but other than that perhaps even a panel of BA officials.

Batkovic won two MVPs under Buckle and another two under Lucas. But yep, Brassard must have been rigging the votes for years. Maybe it was the Russians?

Oh last year was just your typical East Coast bias and anti-anything from WA hate for why she won the award over Sami ;)

That's a pretty good summation. The Melbourne v Perth game from thr weekend is a good example of this. IMO, Whitcomb was Perth’s best player but Liz was dominant for the Boomers. Every chance the votes from the game look like this:

Perth
3 Whitcomb
2 Williams
1 Cambage

Melbourne
3 Cambage
2 Whitcomb
1 Williams

Referees
3 Whitcomb
2 Cambage
1 Williams

So despite it being another very good game from Courtney, she may have only pocketed four votes

Thanks for the explanation. If true it's done this way I believe Taylor won't have been pipped for 3's by teamates much at all and at some point before her injury it would be close between her and Liz. Possibly true that disciplin could affect Liz's tally?? Williams should be the swooper from behind and of course Suzy will poll in a lot of games. Some games Williams work, on LiveStats, only happenned after HT, so top votes might not be so automatic where other keept them alive to HT.

Coaches in sport can have a habit of marking their own players a bit harder and not wanting to be seen as biased, so I guess inividuality in this way would be a factor, although you'd expect they'd be directed to be as realistic as possible.

At this point I suspect Liz is ahead.

I think it's between Liz & Suzy
Sami would have taken way too many votes from Courtney IMO. I've been lucky enough to see a lot of recent Lynx games and Sami has been clutch, even in games she was out-scored. Her influence all over the court is always going to put her in the votes.
Taylor has missed some games, and as mentioned Sydney have a number of players who have also had excellent games in Malott, Snell, Ebzery & Wilson.
Batkovic always gets her numbers, even in losses. I'd have her a nose in front of Liz atm.

All jokes aside, been kind of ridiculous if Suzy wins again in a race against three other players this time.