Melbourne
Sydney
Perth
New Zealand

Illawarra
Brisbane
Adelaide
Cairns

My ladder about a month or so ago was this and don't see any reason to change:

1. Melbourne
2. Perth
3. Illawarra
4. New Zealand

5. Sydney
6. Brisbane
7. Cairns
8. Adelaide

Melbourne
Illawarra
NZ
Sydney
-----------
Brisbane
Cairns
Perth
Adelaide

Sydney
Illawarra or Cairns
Perth
Melbourne

Brisbane
Illawarra or Cairns
Adelaide
New Zealand

The only change I have made from a month ago is Perth down a spot and NZ down 4.

I really like NZ's youngsters but I'm not sure they will get the court time to amaze us as Webster throws up bricks like he's trying to replicate the Great Wall of China.

Still unsure over Illawarra and Cairns but one always seems to make playoffs whilst the other looks pathetic and I just can't tell which is the contender and which is the pretender

I really like the team Adelaide have put together this year, they are going to be really fun and should win a lot of games.

Then you look at the rosters of every other team, and it is hard to see who they will displace to make the top 4.

It truly is a very scary competition this year, best lineups in as long as I can recall. Could easily justify going to the basketball this year just to see the quality of the opponents each and every game (but go Sixers).

XY, you forgot to make a ladder prediction!

I'm surprised everyone is ranking Cairns in the bottom two or three, given that they didn't lose a game in ABC, and played without three starters and their sixth man. Each to their own. Here's my ladder prediction, then:

1. Perth
2. Melbourne
3. Cairns
4. New Zealand

5. Illawarra
6. Sydney
7. Brisbane
8. Adelaide

That was deliberate Freethrows. I really think it is too close to call. Even after this weekend's games, there were too many key outs in just about every team to read too much into the results.

Ppplllrrrrtttt. (Blows a big raspberry at XY.)

Have a go, ya mug! :D

Nobody's going to hold your hand in the flames if you get it wrong, XY! I think I've probably put the KOD on all the teams I've listed as top 4. Show us what you're thinking! Nobody will remember this post come finals time, anyway!

Melbourne
Perth
Cairns
Sydney

Illawarra
New Zealand
Brisbane
Adelaide

As much as I love a good hand-holding (particularly over a nice fire) I don't feel the need to satisfy your curiosity about something I have no firm (or even loose) views about.

That, and it would gall me to do a ladder with the Sixers anywhere below 5th, which is the only reasonably concrete view I hold.

For any rating Adelaide low, they are paying $4 to finish with the most losses.

Illawarra at $6 to make the grand final is some insurance against Melbourne being better.

Cairns paying $21 to win it all.

Way too early for this, but here's my speculation

Melbourne
Perth
Sydney
Illawarra

NZ
Cairns
Brisbane
Adelaide

Should be very competitive.

I have no confidence in these predictions though- so many new players this season including 15 new importsd, a completely new team, new coaches

Melb
Hawks
NZ
Perth

Cairns
Brisbane
Adel
Sydney

Melbourne
Perth
Illawarra
Sydney

Brisbane
Cairns
Adelaide
NZ

Melbourne
Cairns
Perth
Illawarra

Brisbane
Sydney
Adelaide
New Zealand

We're seriously picking NZ for the spoon now?

Yeah why not? The last time they had a change of coach and had no Cedric Jackson they finished 7th.

The last time Brisbane were in the league they finished third, but you've listed them fifth.

The last time Brisbane played was in 2008. There are no constants between that team and the new Bullets that I can make an educated decision on.

The Breakers don't have a very good record without Cedric Jackson. It's just a loose prediction KR, NZ will most likely prove all their doubters wrong once again.

So your prediction is that your prediction is wrong?

Melbourne
Brisbane
Sydney
Perth
Adelaide
NZ
Illawarra
Cairns

Why does a certain poster ruin every thread?
Most of us are just having fun guessing . Seriously doubt anyone will get the 8 teams in the correct order anyway

Adelaide for the spoon, Melbourne and Perth the top two...NFI for the rest of it. Normally this time of year I can throw out a rough idea, but I keep trying to make everyone other than Adelaide a playoff team and it doesn't fit.

KR : Its all a bit of fun mate. Its a prediction that I'm willing to stick with. Sorry if me placing NZ at the bottom of my list upsets you in anyway. There's no need for you to try and slam me for it.

Which prediction are you willing to stick with? The one that they'll finish last, or the one that they'll prove the doubters wrong?

But no, you're right, let's just go back to posting lists of teams in whatever order and stop discussing them. Can't have that!

I'm talking about my prediction of placing NZ at the bottom of my list. I'm happy for a open discussion but I'm not going to get that with you so lets leave it at that. Try not to take everything so serious and personal.

Let people have their opinions KR.

Is this the bit where people drag the thread off-topic to talk about how awful I am, and then complain that the thread has been dragged off-topic? Fun!

I am looking forward to a close season in the NBL this time around, but there can only be a top four-six, not sure how many make finals so here is my take, speculative as it is.

My prediction for the bottom three is to include Adelaide, Cairns and Brisbane but in no particular order. I only put them in the bottom three because I couldn't see how they can push past the other five.

The top three I believe will be made up from Melbourne, Perth and Sydney because I think they are the most solid combinations at this point in time, but who knows how they will actually gel.

That leaves Illawarra and New Zealand to end up in the middle at positions 4-5, but once again I have no idea which one will wind up fourth this early before the season. Not the boldest predictions, I know, but like I said I believe this will be a very close season!

koberulz mate.... learn when to shut up

re: koberulz

If you don't like what he's throwing out, either a) don't respond, or b) just don't read his posts. I don't mind his opinions, every now and then, but I generally stop reading what he writes after about the third post on any given topic. KR, I hop eyou're not offended, I just find that your posts end up being a defensive or offensive stance about your previous posts at that point, and I get bored.

Bear: I'm interested in your rationale behind your top three, middle two, bottom three predictions. This is mostly because you've put Sydney in your top three, in spite of the fact that they haven't filled their last two roster spots, and had a 1:2 win loss ration in the series just played.

I know the pre-season doesn't account for much, but surely it's a stretch for a team that doesn't even have a full complement of players, nine days out from the start of competition, to finish top three?

@Freethrows, fair call, I just have a feeling about the Kings and am bullish on them this season. The coaching and lead up appear better than last year and when they do fill those spots I think they will be pretty good, but I am not certain on anyone.

That's the difficulty, so early in the season, of course I can be completely wrong.

As for the other selections I have made, to be honest they are speculative at best, so I will be interested in how the season pans out for sure...

1)Melbourne
Talent, deep but not sold on the coach.

2)Hawks
A little less talent but maybe just as deep with a better coach than United. Finally addressed their rebounding woes.

3)Perth 'cause Perth

4)Breakers
Shit pre season is nothing new. Penney and Webster will add punch

5)Cairns
Could trade places with Breakers. If Trice is a stud and Nate gets into and stays in shape they may go even higher.

6)Kings
Saying they have a better coach than the last few seasons is like saying player X is a better defender than Ben Allen. Not sold on Gaze or their imports plus think that Maric is a dud.

7) Brisbane. Kickert is a strength and a weakness. Hard to pull a completely new squad together.

8) Adelaide. Over rated coach who relies on individual talent rather than adapting a system to maximise team strength. Will still live and die with Randle and DJ doing their own thing and need to score big to overcome Joey's inability to get the team defence on track

Adelaide looks easy money for the spoon at $4.

Pre-season means nothing, I don't even bother.

Lots of new talent in the NBL this season, going to be interesting to see how it all comes together.
I expect some teams will dramatically fail to live up to expectations, just hard to say who'll they be, and injuries will play a part.

What I find particularly interesting is that several teams seem to have added a lot of height, but the Cats (who were overly tall last year) have gone the other way.

So...what do I get from you boys and girls when I end up being 100% accurate?

You won't be because your order is different to mine!

Can anyone think of any team in NBL history who had a better Aussie crew than Melbourne or Sydney this year?

Maybe the great Bullets of 2007, with CJ Bruton and Sam Mackinnon in the prime, Steve Black, Mick Hill, an aging but still solid Bradtke, an up and coming Gibson?

Their imports can easily be replaced. As long as their Aussie crews stay healthy, they should be very good teams. Fair question marks on Demopoulos and Gaze- but the rosters themselves look staaaacked, and that's without Sydney even signing their last player or two.

I'm fairly sure there have been some solid teams at different points with just one import, or no imports, so maybe there have been better Aussie groups. But with 3 imports this year to round out the roster, Melbourne and Sydney's Aussies are very impressive.

@fstos, I am not just taking into account the appointment of Gaze as the King's nominated head coach, look a little deeper at their coaching and you will see why I am bullish on that aspect of the Kings this season.

I have similarly confident feelings about the Bullets. I'm stoked that they managed to pick Lemanis up, that gave me instant high hopes.
They've put together a very solid roster for a 'new' club. A lot will depend on the impact Bairstow has when he returns.
Jervis could be the most underrated signing of the season. He certainly had the better of Maric on Saturday night.
Not many are picking them for top 4 here, which is understandable considering the quality elsewhere.
But the Bullets do have another import spot up their sleeve if an injury occurs...

Cairns
Who Cares?
Someone.
Don't Care.

Loser.
Loser.
Loser.
Biggest Loser.

#FairAndBalanced.

& Hoggy Time for MVP

Can anyone think of any team in NBL history who had a better Aussie crew than Melbourne or Sydney this year?

Did a couple of Goorj's Kings teams go without imports?

They were stacked with alot of Boomers at the time.
I remember Dontaye Draper coming off the bench which wasn't common duringthat time

I think the ladder positions alway rely on a lot of non-talent factors that crop up during a season, but according to the crowd, the ladder will be: (ave score)

1. Melbourne (1.29)
2. Perth (2.93)
3. Illawarra (3.71)
4. Sydney (4.36)
5. Cairns (5.14)
6. Brisbane (5.21)
7. New Zealand (5.71)
8. Adelaide (7.28)

Personally, I think Brisbane really need to go out hard to get into the top 4 early to build some home town pride. Sydney would be disappointed if they finished less than 2nd based on their roster, coach and general ambience. Melbourne might find the pressure of expectations too much to handle.

Jack Toft... you've gone above and beyond

Thanks Jack Toft was hoping someone would put up consensus ladder.
3 to 7 is going to be close other than Adelaide anyone could play finals

If you're the NBL management, you're probably hoping for something like this...

1 Melbourne
2 Sydney
3 Perth
4 Brisbane

5 Adelaide
6 Illawarra
7 New Zealand
8 Cairns

This Kings team as currently constructed doesn't have a hope of finishing Top 2 IMO.

Some people are getting a bit carried away with their Aussie contingent. Yes Lisch is pretty good (albeit a touch over-rated) but that's probably it.

Newley is towards the end of a long career where he struggled last season in Spain and has made a career out of relying on his athleticism that's starting to dry up now which means he will lose his effectiveness quicker than otherwise would be the case. I think he will be a good player in the NBL capable of the odd very good game but not a star and I think his pre-season performances bear that out.

Maric is just a big body and five fouls. He's slower than the QE2, can't jump and has no touch around the basket. He's their back up centre when Khazzouh is healthy.

Khazzouh pea-hearted and never been part of a winner. Yes he gets rebounds and blocks when he has the desire but settles too much for jumpers offensively. Seems to always be susceptible to being taken out of the game physically.

Cadee at times looks like a potential star in the making but isn't. Too eratic and poor shot selection and not a true floor leader in my opinion.

Garlepp has always struck me as guy that gets his and puts up numbers on weak teams. Doesn't do anything exceptional of note but can be counted on to show effort offensively even if just for selfish reasons. Should be a much better rebounder than he is too.

Hill last season didn't look NBL standard to me.

Imports Whittington looks a bit like a poor man's Childress and should be solid and dependable enough but Bryson doesn't look up to it.

Throw in a rookie coach when even if Vickerman does most of the coaching the jury is still out on him a bit inheriting a strong Breakers team from Lemanis along with Cedric Jackson coming back there doesn't feel me with the greatest faith in the coaching staff.

Playoff contender but not championship contender for mine.

^ Great summary of Sydney, @Zodiac. Pretty close to spot on. I think the only thing you may be wrong on is Jeromie Hill. His biggest problem is that he's a tweener, I think.

Just as a bit of a reply to Zodiac, my thoughts on the individual Kings Aussies, since I said I thought they had a great Aussie contingent:

Lisch- Two time MVP. Very good perimeter defender. Very good scorer. Good play maker. Calm temperament.

Newley- I see him as being a bit like Mark Worthington of a few years back - albeit will play from the wing rather than the post. He won't be brilliant at any one thing, but will nonetheless be a good player. Strong defender, and can score in a variety of ways. Will play the team game without forcing anything, but will do enough to score 12-14 points a game.

Yes, his numbers did drop but he still had a decent stat line in Spain last year. Goulding, Lisch and Penney all played in Spain in season 2014/15- all without putting up particularly impressive numbers- and were 3 of the top players in the NBL in season 2015/16.

Cadee- The kid can flat out score. Has poor shot selection, yes. But so did Lanard Copeland, Shane Heal and Chris Goulding at times (and plenty of others), and that hasn’t stopped them from being 3 of the NBL’s great players- and two of them are championship winners. Cadee’s trend is up, and he’s still quite young.

Khazzouh/Maric- Khazzouh is a bit of an enigma. Dominated the NBL a few years ago, then went overseas and didn’t play in great competitions. Not his best season last year- although he only played 17 games. This year is a crossroads for him. At his best, he’s an elite player in the NBL. Hopefully with a clean bill of health, we’ll see what he’s got.

Maric was good enough to earn a plane ticket to Rio, and would’ve played had Bogut not made a speedy recovery. Played in the Euroleague as recently as 2014. Put up decent numbers in the Adriatic League in 2016. Is slow, but he has the game to be effective, like Jawai was for Perth last season. Like Jawai, will need to watch his fouls, but when he’s going, he’ll be a handful inside the paint. And like Newley, his experience and his game style means he knows how to play the team game and won’t force it. Will only be called upon to play 15-20 mins a game, but his credentials suggest he’ll be a better player in that position than many similar others around the league like Pledger, Holyfield and Jervis.

Those two look like a balanced combination though- Maric will bruise and bang in the paint, Khazzouh has range.

Garlepp is a decent player and has gotten better every season.

My query on Sydney is whether there will be enough ball to go around, given there’s no pure pass first PG on the roster. But their Aussie group has genuine talent, there’s possibly a third import coming, and I suspect Jeff VG will be ready to pull the trigger if Bryson or Whittington don’t look up to it once the season proper gets into full swing.

Correction Goulding is technically a championship winner too, but not in the meaningful sense of being a major contributor...

If you're able to hedge on all 4 of those, that's probably ideal.

1-7: unsure. Way too early to tell.
----
daylight
----
8: Adelaide

So after tonights games have you guys got Perth making the top 4?? Clear lack of offense in the post, serious lapse in offense. First year Perth will NOT make the playoffs. I swear by that.

Hahaha keyboard I like your style, are you that troll they keep posting about?

7: Perth
----
Daylight
----
8: Adelaide

Picture becoming clearer already

I'm not a troll I just know a lot about keyboards.
Microsoft, Logitech, you name it....

One player.... 6'8" Knight isn't going to set the world on fire against a stacked bigman league,.. Perth will come last this year. Terrible misreading of the league, they went for all style and flare rather than actually looking at what would work. I guess they are bored of winning haha,

Everyone thought they were making a mistake going big and slow in a pace and space league last year, look how that worked out.

Everyone thought they were making a mistake going big and slow in a pace and space league last year, look how that worked out.

Jacobsen
DJ
Egwu
Jawai
Pledger
Ogilvy
Holyfield
Bairstow
Jervis

Just a few names who are going to shred the Wildcats in the post this year...

Perth have lost everything that made them Perth last year;

Physical defense and bruisers - Jawai and Jervis...gone

Crucial piece of championship run - Beal...gone

Everyone else went small, they went big and won. Now everyone else has gone big, they've gone small.

They've retained exactly what made them Perth last year - they still play in Perth. And they're still doing something completely different to the rest of the league.

Adelaide will win the championship, Goulding will have another stupendous flop season, David Anderson will prove to be too old.

We need an edit button so I can pretend my ladder predictions were:

Melbourne
Sydney
Illawarra
Perth

Cairns
New Zealand
Brisbane
Adelaide

Another exciting and unpredictable NBL season ahead, isn't this great folks?

First round not even over yet and no one has any idea who will win or who is going to end up where, just the way it should be.

League has changed in such a short time, it is tougher, deeper and more even than ever, great stuff!

I agree Bear, we've seen the Wildcats go down to the Bullets and Melbourne go down to NZ. We've seen Hawks show their strength. It's a pretty damn good start to the NBL to see what might be an AFL type season, every win will count.

This thread will be interesting to re-visit in weeks to come, and at the end of the regular season.

I kind of went for something like this:

Melbourne
Perth
Sydney

New Zealand
Illawarra

Brisbane
Cairns
Adelaide

Although the exact order of the top three, next two and bottom three were not specified, it already looks like Brisbane may be my biggest prediction mistake...

Still, a long way to go of course!

Interesting revisiting this now. Almost everyone had Adelaide and Cairns in the bottom 4.

True, Adelaide has thrown everything upside down, they could be the Bulldogs, Sharks, Cubs of the NBL this season...