Kelly Wilson, Gabe Richards, Bec Allen, Odette Andrew and Emily Fryters will no doubt be gone... Unless Cheryl stays to coach for another year that's the only way I could see any of them even considering coming back.

You can always get new recruits if you are in seabl, BigV expect nothing.

Not sure about the bona fides here, but as an outsider looking in I can't quite believe the amount of negative posting about an Association which has been seen as a bench mark for so long...

One of the big six Melbourne based basketball Associations with a rich heritage and history of success at junior and senior level to be proud of has now been portrayed with the perception of a sinking ship and I for one am sad to see and read about it.

I hope that something positive can come from it and the situation can veresve itself with some leadership and stability!

The constant negativity expressed online can't be a good thing...

...reverse itself...

Not too sure if Knox doesn't have the depth - the kids on the bench don't see much court time, and the time they do see tends to produce results...

Kids coming through like Hare, Waterhouse, Grant and Leigh are all capable SEABL players. Don't forget you have Aver in that group too who has been out injured with an ACL this season.

Knox should stay in the SEABL no doubt, otherwise those 5 guys all walk.

Knox VYCM are in the top 4 teams in the comp at this stage too - must be some good kids coming through that like Tomat, Horstman, Cope, Toman. They could develop into SEABL players if given opportunity.

From what I hear this is the last season for Hill and Phillip. S.Carroll could also be calling it a day at the end of the season. Strong is off to the Bool no doubt. Carter shouldnt be back I dont think. A massive shift, but that was always going to happen!

If Knox do clean out I think they should look for talent at other clubs that aren't getting the opportunities they should be. For Example, Nunawading have Costa Hronopolous and Mark Breda. Costa was the SEABL D League MVP in 2012 and was putting up some big numbers as a combo guard (averaged 22pts 7rebs 4ass 4stls). Mark Breda was MVP in 2011 averaging a double in points and rebounds and leading the assists count (11pts 11rebs and 4ass per game).

With nunawading so deep in the guard spots and with a pg like Shane McDonald, these 2 have not been given a chance to hit the court each week. If Knox can grab these 2 guys it will only help strengthen the group of 20-22yr guys that they have. Costa could potentially start at that 1 or 2 spot, and Mark Breda would be an excellent 6th man. They can both play all they need is the opportunity.

Staying in SEABL of course

I think the 500k is a loss, not a debt. There is a very large difference. Word is that the organisation has eaten largely into strong reserves to fund multiple years of losses.

MUI they have management rights over the state sport centre, not just tenancy. Again, a very big difference.

#429657

I think its been made very clear that there have been losses. The email from their president talks about losses and budgeted losses.

No one has said the revenue stream has dropped. They appear to simply be living beyond their means. of course there may be some extraordinary expenses with the first operational year of the new centre.

It does make sense. It makes pretty simple sense. They cannot cover expenses or commitments currently so they are looking to ways to increase prices or reduce costs to balance their books again.

One of the proposed measures appears to be moving from SEABL to BigV. A considerable saving, reducing the amount of money they need to spend on league fees, on coaching, on players and ancillary costs. Lets say they are currently paying $400k for their SEABL program and can reduce that to $150k in bigV with a very team. In my view the SEABL has been something of a pissing contest for Knox over the years so they may have heavily overextended themselves.

Another option would be a bare bones SEABL program, more like an Albury approach - but not sure the ego's would allow that!

there are no tax implications for a not for profit organisation.

Unless Knox can give some sort of long term commitment to remain in the Big V I don't think the Big V Clubs would accept their entry.

Entry is not decided by the Big V Board - its only recommended to the Clubs to vote on at the AGM.

But you never know what the Clubs will do and how they would vote.

Knox may just end up playing SEABL with a significantly reduced budget for a year or two until they get their house in order.

Just heard the Vice Chairman has resigned from the Board?

Apparently frustated???? Word is he was one of the good guys probably should have been the Chairman.

Shut up Laurie

They just beat 2013 SEABL CHAMPS imo. Why go backwards to big v?

You might do well to read the entire thread anon, then you might not be asking such a stupid question!

My mistake - forgot Knox came in to Big V with the VYC.

I think you'd find the Clubs would still be voting on their entry into CM & CW.

We will just have to wait & see what Knox decide after the SEABL season is over.

They may not be the only Club to leave SEABL in 2014!

Common sense prevails...Dont spend money you havent got on player payments.

#430660

A little uptight?

I am not sure anyone from BigV is sprouting some socialist rubbish. The discussion has been about Knox because there have been strong indications that Knox have seriously considered a move to BigV to assist with their current financial plight. Its a reasonable likely alternative to the current financial situation.

You seem to forget a few things. In the mid 2000's Dandenong stepped back from SEABL to BigV and it did their program no damage at all. No obvious hiccup in their development pathway, no damage to the Dandenong brand etc. They went back to SEABL, largely because of the d-league split, but on the whole it did not hurt them.

Of course the alternative is a small budget team in SEABL. What is the risk to Knox's reputation of this? What if the team fails abysmally? You can be Albury and be rubbish most years in the SEABL because you are the only show in town, but can Knox afford that in metro Melbourne?

Might be better to be a moderately budgeted BigV champ side being successful than a poorly funded unsuccessful SEABL side. Unlike Dandenong, Knox have a reasonably poor record over the years of funneling junior talent into senior programs so it might be harder for Knox to genuinely put a low budget competitive SEABL unit on the floor.

To be clear. I am NOT advocating either. Just giving you some clear and rational reasons why it is being discussed and what the alternatives are.

There has been very little speculation btw in recent years about SEABL teams joining BigV. Its been a fairly static situation, generating very little discussion, since the 2009 moves.

Apologies to Albury there. Typed that a bit quickly!

#430680

Interesting speculation. In my view it was a circumstance, not a pre-considered decision, that moved Dandenong and Sandringham to SEABL in that year.

Both teams had actually committed to BigV for the following season (2010 from memory) and it was the overall pullout of the other YL teams to form the d-league that precipitated the move to SEABL for the relevant senior sides. Their hand was forced to some degree (not saying they were not compliant!)

All of this occurred AFTER the BigV's AGM, which is when acceptances are normally official.

I remember it very well, because the other BigV clubs (those left behind) were furious, left with a budget deficit, a competition restructure etc after the official close date.

Who are the players in the last 10 years who have come through the junior ranks of Dandenong-Knox-Kilsyth and then through their SEABL teams to progress to the NBL.

Why I ask because I'm not sure there have been too many at all.

If you take a look at a small country Club like Horsham you will find they have produced 4 junior players to progress through to the NBL in the last 10 years.

For most of that time Horsham played Big V Div 2 so the perception that these three SEABL Clubs provide a real pathway to the NBL for juniors seems hard to believe in my opinion.

#430694

As I have said to many people here, its not a fact because you say it is. It remains speculative, unless you can support it with evidence.

Not being disrespectful to you, but you are basically saying "I am right because I say I am". That's not an argument.

As indicated, if I have the sequence of events correct, and I think I do, Dandenong had decided to stay in BigV for that year, but the post agm maneuverings made it virtually impossible for them to stay. That would indicate that they did not make a decision to go to back to SEABL at all, based on brand, rather than on other issues that were emerging.

At the time Dandenong were very focused on moving athletes on to College rather than national league - it was seen as a key outcome for their YL teams, and they were having great success with that strategy.

VP, I agree with you to a large extent. I think many of the big associations have performed very poorly, considering their weight of numbers, in this regard. Nunawading in my view have generally done ok.

I would suggest that Dandenong have had good long term success transitioning female players btw.

Your Horsham example is fantastic. McDonald, Bruce, Creek, Bruce...

The move to Big V was a huge help to Dandenong. Did them absolutley no damage and credit to them for having the courage to do it.

Dandy did it short term to get straighen out but the plan was to always go back to SEABL in the meduim term.

At the time the BIGV/VBL needed Dandy as much as Dandy needed them so it worked well for the profile etc.

Things are a little different now and the Big V for all of there short comings are pretty well runs and in a good financial position so I doubt the members will vote in knox for just 1 or 2 seasons...it would have to be a 4 or 5 year deal as a minimum to satisfy the Big V membership.

Is being in the Big V for 4/5 years want knox want? It will hurt them in the medium to long term with Juniors, sponsors etc, but I guess that's a call for people from within the club to make.