You use the phrase 'let alone' wrong, multiple times, and it's annoying. As for the 5 man, not sure.

^You are disrespecting the city of Cairns with posts like that.

As for the Center, it's not going to turn out well at all. Then again, expectations might be so low, he turns out half decent.

Actually, let alone was used correctly, twice. But that's not really relevant to this discussion.

@Statsheet Stuffer: are you talking in general due to the fact that there is literally no quality guys out there for less than 8 points or is there someone specific in mind? I've got a bad feeling we are going to be reliving the Ben Allen "experience" all over again.

If it goes as badly as I fear it might, the Crocs would have been better off signing Nevill or Hudson up front and then Leon Henry for Pace's spot.

No I really cannot think of anyone, that's what I was getting at. Nick Horvath perhaps. Don't have a clue what his nationality or points are but he seems like he could do the job. Pretty sure he will come from the NZNBL whoever he is.

Horvath is a naturalised New Zealander so that's a start. I'll hit up my sources and see if they're onto someone.

Yeah but there is a difference between small ball and starting someone who is 6'6" at the five. Conklin is already undersized for the four. Conklin and Holmes both appear to be great rebounders but there is a difference between rebounding and defense. However I do understand the sentiment of not just grabbing any old stiff.

Conklin stil hasn't been officially signed so maybe they are better off going with a Hudson / Henry option or Nevill / Henry.

Is there any Aussie bigs in the SEABL or NZBL outside of horvath? From memory Horvath has a good job and lifestyle in NZ so good chance he isn't going to play for the $$$ on offer.


I guess if they can pluck a solid Vet from state leagues rather than a project player would be ideal in case Rusty (made of glass) Hinder goes down and you need mins from them.

Personally I would've preferred they pick up Hudson and Henry, but I trust that Shawn Dennis must have information that we don't.

Given the Josh Pace signing, would you rather pick up a 5-man that isn't up to snuff, or cut your losses and play small ball?

If you matchup a legit big remaining on the market (presumably *gulp* worse than Ben Allen...) up against the likes of Matty Knight, Alex Pledger, Schenscher/DJ and AJ Ogilvy, you can't expect him to compete.

1. Starting Hinder without playing him 'starters minutes' is always an option.
2. I don't believe starting someone under 6'8" at center is such a big issue in the NBL so long as the Crocs play an incredibly strict team-orientated game and at a faster pace.

Playing small ball may give Townsville the opportunity to really forge an identity and reward the community for their efforts to save their team.

Yeah isn't Horvath a physics teacher or something during the day? He sounds pretty well settled.

Crocs are at least 200k under the cap so technically they can sign anyone they want, it's just the points cap that has them hamstrung. Anyone from Europe is an immediate no due to the points cap.

You've got guys like Greg Vanderjagt but it's a bit unfair to expect them to walk into a starters' role and hold down the middle without copping a tonne of flack.

And if you go small, Conklin and Holmes both can't shoot (Holmes will try and fail, while Conklin has attempted a handful of threes during his entire career), which means you aren't getting the full value of small ball (guys 1 through 4 being threats from outside to stretch the defense and suck defenders out of the paint).

Which means you aren't playing "small ball" so much as you are playing "traditional ball with a grossly undersized lineup". The whole point of small ball is having four shooters on the floor. It's the only time it works.

At this point I trust Shawn Dennis to put a decent team together, because I like the group of guys he has assembled so far, so I hope he's got something up his sleeve.

Having said that, if the last signing is an end of the bench guy, and not a key contributor, we are really going to struggle.

Whether it is some fantasy-land re-rated Kazzouh or Luke Nevill or just another versatile 3/4 to add to the mix to go all in on this small ball thing, we still need someone else who can score the ball down low, whether from the post or a slashing game, or we are going to be looking at 2012/13 all over again.

You could start putting together a list of Aussies from each local leagues and you might find someone worth taking a punt on. Remembering ideally you want them to 6"9 and above.

Sam Harris 7"3
Jeff Dowdell 6"9
Greg Vanderjagt 7"0
Ross Allsop 6"11
Martin Iti 7"0

Just to name a few

Greg Vanderjagt - not much skill but you know he is going to put in the effort. You can always root for a guy who tries. He's proven at this level too, and on this team. Can handle himself and can play decent D, but slow as hell.

Ross Allsop - I don't know anything about Allsop but his numbers in the Waratah league look intriguing. Unproven at this level though.

Sam Harris - no thanks. Anyone who is 7'3" and isn't already playing in this league must have something severely wrong with them. Averages 4 rebounds in the SEABL despite being a head taller than most other guys.

Dowdell - a known quantity and proven contributor at this level. At only 6'9" though, I'd rather start Holmes. Wouldn't mind him on my team, but if the point here is to have an inside presence to clog up the middle and bang with Pledger, Schensch, Ogilvy, etc. then he probably doesn't fit.

Martin Iti - never saw anything from him during his time in the NBL outside of some nice looking dunks.

I'd actually take Vandy over the rest, but that's probably only because I have seen him play more than the others. Like mentioned above, you'd play him and Hinder limited minutes at the five and play small for most of the game.

I'd be happy to go all in on the small ball if Conklin and Holmes weren't both already undersized. They both are closer to the size of NBL swingmen, and already play above their size at the four. Asking them to man the five all season long is a stretch.

The Crocs learnt a valuable lesson last season by getting smashed on both ends in the paint prior to Nevill's arrival so you would think they wouldn't want to relive that.

What about Rick Rickert? Has he been naturalised as a kiwi?

nope Ricketts still a yank

Pretty sure Rickert was only naturalising as a Kiwi to get the gig at Gold Coast, before that fell through, then he took off overseas...

Just noticed Rickert wasn't listed as an import on the NZBL website and it got me a little perked up...

Must be a mistake?

see what happened to Cairns when they went small at the 5 spot.....

"see what happened to Cairns when they went small at the 5 spot....."

^ THIS

or what happened to Townsville before the signed Luke Nevill...

Angus Brandt, university of Oregon? 11.3 and 8.5

Mystro - ^ THIS?

What do you mean?

All depends on what Markovic is rated as because he hasn't been rated yet. But 8 would be pretty fair for him I think. I must have counted wrong earlier, but yeah you're right it seems they have 9 points to play with.

Angus Brandt went down early last season with a season ending injury in his senior year. He was granted "medical hardship" to get another year of eligibility for 13/14, so he's not going to come play for the Crocs.

I think you can rule Cam Bairstow out as well, also with another year of college eligibility. Same story for Loe and Hodgson.

Neil Mottram has retired, so no.

I don't see Matt Neilsen coming back to Australia to play for Townsville, but it would be nice. Don't really want Dan Kickert for the money he would be asking (too soft).

Khazzouh is a nine though. Interesting.

I think they should also look at getting Luke Nevill rated down. If Khazzouh's stats were better than Nevill's in every single category in the NBL, how is he a point lower?

"Mystro - ^ THIS? What do you mean?"

I meant it was a great point, they (Cairns) were 1 half decent big man off competing with the top teams last season.

Who's Johnson, anon?

Not the worst idea, anon, if it works financially.

You guys are thinking too highly of Vanderjagt.

Yeah Vandy proved unequivocally during his short-term contract when Luke Schenscher went down the season before last that he is ten times the player Ben Allen is. You got to compare A-B every game.

Lots of Crocs fans were sad to see him leave when Schensch came back because we knew he was a far better option than Ben Allen.

Like I said, you can always root for a guy when you can see he's working his butt off out there.

I think the imports are clever signings. Both have good college pedigrees. Conklin went to St Louis and could turn out to be another Kev Lisch - a real surprise package.

Markovic is going to make a big impact. Not just for our team but the league too.

Deric could easily be rookie of the year (if he still qualifies for it?) His performance in the semis last year against Perth was nothing short of oustanding for an 18 year old.

If they can now sign a player like Vandy - who comes in and plays a similar role to a player like Trueman did in Perth that would be perfect. All they need is for him to play 10 - 15 mins a game and be 7ft. And not Ben Allen!!

It's looking like Dennis knows what he's doing for sure. Seems to be a very mobile team he's assembled which fits the uptempo style of game he said he was going to run when he took the job.

I'm excited about this season, If the imports work out well, it will be a good season and the start of a new era for the Crocs as they develop over the next few seasons.

Wasn't there a criticism of Vanderjagt in the past that he didn't quite excel when there wasn't an immediate contract at stake? I remember him putting up good numbers for the Blaze when he was trying to prove himself too.

so much Ben Allen love lol!!