I don't know, sometimes I think zone should be banned at a junior level in this country. Or at least it should be banned at the rep level.

It's a big reason why we don't produce many guys who are great ballhandlers or on-ball defenders (ie.

Development creates winning.My teams only play man to man and they have for 2.5 years.Never once played zone.Zone has its place without doubt but my job is to teach my kids.Each to there own...

Playing as a youngster I remember that we had to play man and no zone.

We only play Zone these days, mostly because we're old and lazy

Basketball in the ACT used to ban zone defence (not sure if the still do)and players were forced to play man. Teams could be first warned and then tech fouled if they played zone. The only problem with this was that when ACT teams went away to tournaments etc they had trouble playing against a zone. Not sure what the answer is but players should definitely be taught the skill/s of playing man-to-man!

Zone always will be detrimental to the game.
You learn more against man and it promotes more skill, as opposed to height. The teams that generally play zone, tend to be taller, more laterally challenged players who can't stick it with the more athletic and skillful players.

Get rid of it for good across all ages I say, but that'll never happen.

Isn't there one SA club that is notorious for zoning?

Zone is easy to beat- pass and displace- opposition coaches should have been able to dismantle it easily!

Maybe zone should only be allowed for 1 half? I believe some domestic comps have adopted that rule.

Never feared the zone when my opposition coach deployed one against a team I coach, no matter the age, I actually welcome it because it excites me to get my players thinking how they can beat a zone and scoreboard against it.

Always try to turn a negative into a positive when you are coaching kids, they feed off it, don't complain about zone D if it is not banned...

My philosophy has always been to play straight up man-man or ball-man D!

D is for development...

As long as they are playing basketball consistently and are being taught all the time then I don't care what happens (I think bigs should do all the passing, dribbling, outside shooting and stealing practice like the guards and the guards should learn to crash boards, set screens, block out on rebounds etc...). I hope that these kids are eager to learn and the coach has the capability to keep teaching them.

Actually, I wasn't thinking of them in particular.

Actually, I wasn't thinking of them in particular.

I thought everyone in SA basketball thought zoning was the answer to all the problems with basketball in South Australia?

So let me get this right.

The DV Coach is also the Vic Metro coach? He plays zone because his team cannot play man?

He is considered to be an elite coach?

He wins the Classic?

I am so confused!! How can a coach in this guys position be allowed by the hierarchy in Basketball Victoria to operate this way.

At my club, coaches are told to leave their egos at the door. Player development is KEY - the DV boys and parents may well be happy to win a gold medal at the classic. But do they understand their kids are being short changed by a coach who's only interested in his own win/loss record.

Wake up BV and get this coach and others like him to focus on bringing our basketball youth talent on so they can hopefully realise their true potential.

Coaches with huge egos who place winning over development at junior basketball level have no place in our game.

^^well played!

Can't argue with most that has been posted thus far.

Development, and therefore man defence is virtually always the way to go, but zones do have their place in junior basketball. Personally, I like an aggressive zone as a change-up from press/man defence, similar to how it's used in the NBL. It's important for juniors to learn about zones so long as it doesn't come at the expense of defensive fundamentals.

I like SA's rules regarding zones, even if it hurts our chances at Classics etc. But the enforcement of the zoning rules could be improved.

I certainly couldn't generalize this across an entire club, but some U14 Sturt and West Adelaide coaches run stealthy zones, and a senior U16 coach at North runs a zone almost exclusively. Poor form.

@Jack - did I pick a winner?

I think you may have.

There's a sneaky zone with one guard "hunting" outside the arc, the other 4 in a zone. Cut a player and they don't move/follow. Dumb refs think its man, very clever.

Every team needs to have options. They should have at least one good zone AND a good man-to-man, and generally a press as well.

To me, that's development as well as common-sense - if the team has limited options then they become predictable, which makes them easier to beat.

development is far more important. winning games in the bonus

Hi,

My name is Ross Clark, coach of the successful and gold medal winning team at the Classic.

To give you some background to the key board warriors who use this website, I am the only Life member coach of Diamond Valley association and I ahve coached there for over years.

For those questioning my credentials at developing players, I have coached Australian reps players such as Kevin Probert, Matt Jackson, Greg PagE.

I have coached numerous Vic Metro and Vic Country players over that time including Kristian Williams, Tim Bongetti, Nick Dean, Cameron Conlon, Ben Mossuto, Drew McKenzie, Matt Johnston, Daniel Suter just to name a few.

To those questioning my win/loss record, I can assure you I have coached numerous teams during my time at DV with a negative win/loss ratio.

Yes, i am the Vic metro head coach, have been for the last years going into my third year and happy to say that I have won Nationals twice, playing man to man at all times.

I won VC last year in Under 18's defeating Melb Tigers again playing man to man.

So I am more than happy to stand by my record both in developing players and also winning and losing.

To say that my team is hopeless in playing man to man is a slight on the capability of my current under team. Yes we are workig hard at in practice to develop these players as we work hard on all of our fundamentals.

So do we play zone with this group, yes we do. Do we press up the floor, yes we do, do we trap, yes we do. At no stage have I hidden the fact that we play zone, however I would like to think we do all of these things well.

Good close outs
Being able to keep between the ball and the basket when defending the ball
Good ball pressure
Players bumping cutter
Players moving on the flight
Good communication
Being able to find the player in your area and boxing out

So again, to anyone who wishes to discuss this with, feel free to do so, I happy to do so. in the mean time though, give these players the respect they deserve, they won games at the classic, beating Melb twice, coming from 16 down at 3 quarter time in quarter final.

Nothing wrong with what you're doing Ross, some people have posted rants, better to be ignored.

The post asks the question if development is more important than winning, also it refers to the Classic, Vic teams and secondary comments about the winning 16's team playing zone (allegedly) all tournament.

Some good points have been made about what looks like a zone and how a good man defense actually may appear to be zone like to some.

Ross knows what he is doing IMO, would not be where he is if he didn't...

Developing sound defensive skills, including a good understanding of how a zone can be deployed or conversely how you can beat a zone is important for juniors if they want to play at a higher level.

Some posts here appear a little to subjective, personal cricism based on rumour or uneducated guessing is poor form, stick to what you know, others should be ignored.

I agree with Bear.

One of the things about coaching is reacting to what the other coach is doing. If putting up a zone defence in U16 is winning games and the opposition coach can't break it, then why blame a coach for winning. At Classics winning is everything, so why not make it hard for the opposing coach and make him/her think.

Playing a zone in U10 is questionable.

Yeah, the point of coaching coaches is probably very valid. The best Associations out there have an active coache's coach, someone who takes the time to attend training sessions and watch representative teams (especially) play games when possible and give feedback on key elements to improve...

Not only improve fundamentals in kids, but improve the coaches, the system, the whole program if you like. Victorian clubs just seem to have a more established system, perhaps this is why a perception of self-confidence is portrayed as arrogance by some?

Invariably you will find that the coach who stops learning because he/she believes they know it all will in fact become a frustrated coach, you see them all the time...

Anon, any offensice system or structure, be it suffle or another popular set of plays relies on the players being able to run the play with sound fundamentals.

So, to answer that one, all the kids at Melbourne would need to know:

Timing
Patience
Passing
Catching
Footwork
Shooting
Screening
etc...

Can't have the chicken without cracking the egg, or is that the horse in front of the cart??

Regradless, can't run the shuffle with players who are not taught reasonably sound fundamentals first, cheers...

Typo, sorry offensice should be offensive of course.

Also, can I add that in a system like Melbourne's I believe the suffle (or whatever the fancied system is at another Association) would be taught in segments.

Under 12's start by learning the basics, the fundamentals, then slowly introduce one part of the offensive structure.

Introduce the whole system bit by bit, under the watchful eye of the head coach and slowly but surely by the time they are 18's they can run the system with eyes closed.

But, more importantly they have the basics of the game down pat as well...

It's just how a club goes about it mate, the structure needs to be clear and getting all coaches on board is crucial, no cowboys or egos to wreck it along the way and over time any club can get there...

I have no problems with zone being taught and implemented at any level of junior basketball, provided other forms of D are also used. Extremely important kids are taught solid man to man skills and that this form of D is the most used/developed. I also see a problem with kids being taught to run the same offence during a any rep season or the chief offence in any team. I run a basic turnout type offence with my VJBL 16 boys team, but I do give my boys the license to take a player on one on one when the situation demands it. All kids need to be able to handle the ball and create, something that most offenses stop.

"A good man-to-man looks like a zone, and a good zone looks like a man."

DV Coach needs to chill - all I asked was winning or development.

Settle down Miss Clark.

Anonymous #423465.

I made one post - the original one. I was seeking debate about winning or development.

I don't know the DV coach personally - I made comment on what I saw and what people spoke to me about at the classic.

I was commenting on the amount of Zones being played at the classic - the 16s Final example was used to highlight my point. What's the big deal??

A personal grudge - not likely. A keen interest in the game and in particular the development of young athletes - guilty as charged!!

Perhaps you should go back and read the threads a little more carefully.

My last post was a dig at the emotional over reaction of the DV Coach's post. Nothing I've said is personally directed at this coach, it was about the perceived over use of Zones.

This topic is about basketball people commenting on the good and not so good things about our game.

Chill out man!!