I think you could pretty much say 100% of those boos were aimed at two men

This article is what I was on about previously.

http://www.perthnow.com.au/sport/basketball/support-for-under-siege-adelaide-36ers-coach/story-fndekszl-1226545084443

"The Breakers coach was a combined 20-45 in his first two seasons in New Zealand and had many calling for his head.

So when he saw Clarke cop boos from the Adelaide Arena crowd after a 71-66 defeat on Friday night, he felt his pain."

Guys Lemanis had a WORSE record than Marty.

NZB shows what is possible when the team, the fans, and the community is behind the Head Coach.

^ exactly but everyone wants a championship yesterday. I believe the first season most of the squad was already contracted so it was a case of making best with what he had and then he set about putting things in place to build a club culture that could succeed and not just once but over multiple years. It took him a while and there were plenty of times that uneducated Herald reporters called for him to be sacked (the season before the 1st championship where they went on a big run towards the end after picking up Braswell only to just fall short of the playoffs).

boos were some sort of frustration - we looked a million dollars in the first half then turned the ball over at crucial times in the clutch

it reminded me of a game here a few years ago when cairns pressed up and we went to water after a good lead and strong performance - about 4-5 years ago after a good lead.

Anon'941...Absolutely agreed, I think another 3 years under Marty we will be able to reap the rewards of hard toil of the previous 3.

Don't know about the Salary increase though.

Lemanis didnt have one of the best lineups on paper and didnt have the best depth bench.
Put it in perspective everyone hyped up out team this year and was happy with what we had recruited. Yet we are clearly not even close to being a playoff contender.
Issue with the Coach? I think so

Actually Marcus, 20-45 is NOT better then 17-39.

1st season - 9-19 = 32% record
2nd season - 8-20 = 28% record
3rd season - 5-8 = 38% record currently with the addition of Gibson, Schenscher, Cadee and Petrie

Marcus are you still sticking with your "Please also keep in mind that Marty's record is greatly improved from the last 2 years."?

The crowd reaction was at the coaches. They might not be directly related for that loss but the fans let them know they aren't wanted here

Lemanis 20 wins from 65 games or 31%
Clarke 17 wins from 56 games or 31%

Interesting

Just to add it isnt JUST the win % that the crowd is mad at.
Add the messingale saga
Add the simpson saga
well add all the imports that never got along with radford.
Creeks court time
3 year plan revolving around Stevie the 9th wonder of the world weigh.
3 year plan having just 1 player from the first year.
The drama in the front office.
The drama in the cairns game and the 9 point play.
The fact we have never played out a game well and most of the time we do not win clutch games.
What possibly anoys me the most is marty doesnt coach on the fly, he cant adjust to what other teams throw at us (2nd half full court man v NZ for example)
What have i missed? That list seems awfully short

(I didnt boo btw)

The Lemanis argument could be used to support any failing first time coach, right?

I don't remember Lemanis having quite the fervent opposition from fans.

actually Lemanis did have a good squad the year before the championship, he didn't make the playoffs despite having the best player in the league in Kirk Penney and 3 quarters of Tallblacks and the feeling was if he can't do it with these guys is he capable of doing it at all. luckily management saw the big picture.

Lemanis did a heap of great things behind the scenes that gave people confidence in him, especially the development program and getting CJ Bruton over here was great for the Breakers and basketball in NZ. He made all the players available to the public after games and as a result the public have embraced the franchise although winning has definitely helped get bums on seats.

@Smith what is the Simpson saga? i could say that because of the nudging he got from the 36ers coaches to get better he got an NBA contract. That is a pretty good result for Simpson dont you think?

Massingale was a risk and failed as an experiment. Get as emotional as you like about him the stats dont lie.

NEVER have played out a game? You never saw the close wins v Perth and others over the last few years?

3 year plan comment has consistently been taken out of context for people to suit an argument against Marty. Did you expect him to say i have no idea what i am doing or plan to do? I am still yet to see a written quote attributed to Marty that he indeed actually said this at all.

All the imports that never got along with Radford? this is the guy responsible for recruiting Lisch, Redhage and Devries to Australia remember. Perhaps he has justifiable high expectations and expects imports to not be here on holiday or resume building. Dont you want the coaches to have the best players playing for the right reasons on court?

3 year plan involving Weigh? He was playing for Perth in the 1st year and i personally believe he is a very solid player. He chose to leave a winning program to help rebuild Adelaide.

1 player from the first year? Yep again players have retired under their own steam plus they had to get rid of players that are perennial losers, free up some cap space to get some better pieces in which they have finally done. Dont underestimate what a noose Ballinger's contract was around the roster for the last 2 seasons.

Ballinger choosing to leave to chase a higher financial offer lead to money that was free'd up to recruit the names we have.

Having said all of that Marty is a realist and knows that he will be judged by the W and L column. The culture has been turned 180 degrees because of he and Radford's efforts. The wins aren't their and it is as frustrating for him as it is the players and fans.

On the subject of recruiting imports, which ones can the 36ers lay claim to finding and bringing to the NBL since their creation? 2 imports per season is a potential list of 60 names. I am talking players that you would gladly have back at any time.

Farley v 1.0
Brooks
Davis
Brunson

4 names in 30 years is the sum total successful recruiting of imports the 36ers have done. Does that give you an idea of how hard it is to get it right. Even Farley was chased out of town eventually.

Every other name ( Mee , Rose, Rychart, Ballinger etc) has been poached from another team. I could even go further and highlight that Davis wasn't actually recruited by the 36ers, but happened to be in Adelaide at the time with South.

Bring back a local boy that has been away for many years and was an original Sixer himself.
The boy has many qualifications and has been successful in Junior and Senior coaching gigs(Premierships locally and accross borders)
He has International knowledge and experience coupled with a passion to continually be successful.He builds teams through Development of Juniors and gains valuable experienced players if needed for his team mix.
This guy cares about SA basketball and understands supporter interest and enthusiasm while keeping things simple yet challenging for his teams.
As "King Cole" recently said" Basketball should not be complicated play D play O and back your team to be better at executing both over your competitor"
DK worth a shot we have tried lesser experienced coaches!!

Lucky the breakers have been free from injury!!! How would they go if jackson or wilkinson went down for a season???

And amazingly NO other NBL team has recruited any of the 36ers discarded imports either

Think we could all agree that Kirk Penney had a lot to do with the NZ turnaround! Lemanis is still one of the luckiest coaches to still have a job, and his case is a very rare one. Never happens the way it has in NZ, usually the club piss the guy off when he has under performed. Adelaide is due now.

Yeah Lemanis is so lucky, if anyone like Penney or Wilkinson ever left theyd crumble because their system is terrible and they just rely on individual talent.

Im referring to the fact, that at a point when they couldve parted ways with Lemanis, Penney came along and although they didnt make the playoffs the first season, showed more promise than they had under Lemanis previously.

King James...you got me...Marty has a worse record by .4 of a percent.

When I noticed Marty's improved record it was before the 4 game slide.

The point still stands that Lemanis had to build the pieces slowly and he needed the support of the fans throughout this time. Keep in mind also that sixer fans were calling for Marty's head last season too when he didn't have close to the talent to compete.

I think this is a great example of what is achievable when EVERYONE is on board with the same goal.

@Mystro - actually, the year the Breakers signed Kirk Penney they DID make the playoffs, eventually losing to the defending champions Brisbane Bullets in the elimination final.

@Marcus Camby -
Year 1/2: Andrej Lemanis fared similar to Marty Clarke in his first two seasons, and both were criticized. Fair enough.

Lemanis' 3rd Year: accrued a talented roster that was capable of winning games, and did just that: making the playoffs for the first time in Breakers' history.

Clarke's 3rd Year (thus far): 5-8, and under-performing given the talent they accrued following the demise of the Gold Coast Blaze.

If Clarke doesn't begin putting together a winning season, then you're 'Andrej Lemanis argument' isn't a very sound one...

FUN FACT:
Scott Ninnis only lasted two years (25-33 overall record) at the 36ers due to leading the club to their worst record ever of 10-18 in his second year of a three-year-contract... only to be surpassed by Marty Clarke's 9-19 record the following season.

@Marcus Camby - but everyone WASN'T on board with Lemanis... that's why fans were calling for his head!

Word of advise: don't re-frame information to suit your purpose, then click the 'undo' button to make another argument.

@Smith...

What simpson Saga?

He went onto the NBA, how would you like Marty or ANY NBL coach to stop that?

Also that 'inadvertent' tech foul from the bench is LONG forgotten, lets please move forward.

U need luck to win a championship to!!!!

Clarke wasn't universally a mistake at the time, it's the long term contract that's proven troublesome, and he wouldn't have come into the NBL without that security.

For all the talk of alternatives, how many of them have come back into the league? The FNQ teams went with lesser knowns rather than Stacker, Gleeson, Joyce, etc. I think Clarke with some KPI clauses would've been smarter in hindsight.

Back to Lemanis, I don't remember consistent poor results in similar circumstances - maybe losses on the road? They didn't have a habit of giving up leads, for example, or struggling to adapt to changes from the opposition?

Part of the turnaround IMO seemed to come with Vukona replacing Forman (out of position in NZ) and Ronaldson. That defensive upgrade was pretty key, I think. The big change before that was Bruton arriving with the under-appreciated Boucher. Great defensive team player plus clutch closer.

I was hopeful that Petrie and Massingale would play those Vukona and Bruton roles for us.

@Anon'010

How do you want the team to react after the game, hold a wake? Wail whilst they slap themselves?

I would like to challenge you statement that sixer fans would not boo Maher with an 0 - 10.

6ers fans have shown OPENLY and fervently their penchant for hanging their coach out to dry.

On Simpson, the coaches didn't consider him a smart player for their system. IMO, they should adjust their system to create something that works to the strengths of natural talents. Otherwise, you're left with a handful (including Weigh) who know what they're doing and guys like Creek or Massingale in the wrong places at the wrong time.

Argument against that is that a successful team like Perth or the Wollongong starters (as another example) see success through systems rather than freelancing talent. You can see how up and down the Hawks can be when Deleon either goes off or misfires and derails them all.

Kobe...fair go mate...to call Lemanis lucky is just disrespectful.

Yes he got Penney, just like Wildcats got Grace, just like Sixers got Maher and Lindsay had a son called Andrew.

Every team gets stars throughout their time, not every team makes something of it.

PlaymakerMo...

Give me a break, that was my first go typing a reply using a tablet, somehow I pressed go or submit.

Mystro is correct, NZ missed the playoffs by a game the year before the championship.

Marcus Camby you must be taking the piss, because there is no way anyone could be so blindly supporting that excuse for a coach's arsehole in Clarke. Not only has he failed to deliver, he has acted like a spoilt child refusing to see the error of his ways. The only consistent thing about him is his blatant disregard for the fans who indirectly pay his wages and try to support a team he has driven to nothing. Be patient he says.........it takes time to put a winning team together........I am not bothered by the win loss ratio......all comments from this glorified development coach who has not got a clue how to win on game day. There should be no comparison to Lamanis......his name shouldn't even come up in the same conversation.

Camby and BJF I see the angle you are both taking (cannot understand why?) but Clarke and Radford have had sufficient time to get things right. @Smith @Isaac & @Playmaker Mo made really good points of the many short comings.

At the end of the day he cannot make the transition from coaching kids to pro athletes - he has tried and failed as they don't seem motivated to play hard for him - happens a lot in the US. When we lose the next few games the coaches will find someone else to blame.

Things which probably saved Lemanis:

- NZ viewpoints towards their teams in Australasia competitions. The NZ media and fans understand that Australian comps like the NRL, Super Rugby etc. are extremely tough to win and so I think that gave Lemanis a bit of leniency. No Kiwi expects a kiwi team to win an Australian comp (and especially not a team in their 3rd season -- when Lemanis took control)

- He never gave an ultimatum like Clarke. He never said about a 3 year plan etc.

- The Breakers were in just their 3 season when Lemanis took over. So I think the owners were concerned with 'forming the identity and culture of the club' as much as they were concerned about wins.

- Don't want to comment too much on the respective rosters, as not too sure about them fully. But from what I have seen, the 36ers roster looks stronger across many positions and deeper. From what I remember, the Breakers had stud imports like Powell, Melzer (who did well), Chappelle etc. and decent locals like Olson and Pepper, but they had some average players filling the other positions.
It looks as though the 36ers have more depth than the Breakers teams of old, yet the games back in the day were 48 minutes.

Mystro
You can debate whether MC can coach, but his recruitment record is horrible. All his first year players were on new contracts, untolled import mistakes.He has recruited/signed and burned player after player and his current crop of very talented players are playing poorly. A coaches responsibility to have his players perform at their best. His record is nothing short of atrocious. Undeniable facts.
Who is a better player for their experience in
Adelaide. Even the chosen one in Stevie is performing below his Perth efforts, where, by the weigh he came off the bench.
He has a chance over the next week to reverse trend
or it is too late. I hope he does but his record does not give me confidence.

@paul - apologies if I'm mistaken. My information came from the Breakers' Wikipedia page since pas NBL information is hard to come by.

@Marcus Camby - no idea what you're on about with regards to your tablet... do you mean that your posts defending Marty Clarke were simple mistakes?

If so, that's one tablet gone haywire!

No dramas mate, I think you were talking about 08 and 09 when they did make the playoffs, and Mystro was talking about 10 when they had a disastrous middle patch of the year and dropped seven of nine to miss out.

Ironically, until they signed Braswell late in the year they were better when Penney was injured than with him in the line-up that season for whatever reason.

I think Marty needs to work on his PR a bit to make him more appealing to fans

Yes x 10. He has got a little better at that but was woefully abrasive in his first year.

Should've done that from the beginning. Club should've insisted on it (and paid for media training) as soon as it was clear he lacked in that department. Part of the job and the industry. Get on the front foot. All I can remember is a vomit-inducing puff piece along with Radford in the Sunday Mail about their preparations for a game.

I think Marty speaks fine in pre-game interviews with TV (prefer that to Phil's fake smile - that got pretty grating by the end!), but needs to add some personality to it all and get an identity. Though are many other coaches much better? Most can be a pretty serious bunch.

Teams's usually reflect the peronality of their coach.
There in lies much of the problem. Robotic, no spontaneous reactions, never excited, over analytical etc etc.
Sport is emotional unfortunately our coach is quite the opposite.

Some of you guys are funny, lets keep Marty Clark and see how the team is going in 3 years, yeah sure, you think the talanted players Adelaide have bought are going to hang around a losing club until the coach learns how to coach, what crap.

Forum comments are overwhelmingly against Marty. Who exactly are you disagreeing with?

Yes one thing I would concede about Marty is his choice of words.

The 'win loss ratio' one was a head scratcher.

As was the one in the NZ game where he mentioned the All-Star break nullifies NZ's (winning) and ADL's (losing) streaks.

These thankfully can be rectified with mentoring from more media savvy people in the org in the season to come.

Getting back to original post.

I booed. I booed at the umpires not the team.

I chanted "Sack Marty Clarke" aimed at Marty Clarke.

It is pure disappointment, frustration, and now anger that has pushed me to this. It wasn't pre-meditated, it just came flowing out like the 'Holy Spirit' had taken over my body. (I thought Radford was going to charge at me like I was waving a red flag at a bull)

Honestly, if any of you have ever played or coached at reasonably high level, you'll understand. For those of you that don't understand, I pity your ignorance.

Clarke's happy : " Fans can boo , the players effort was great and we train hard. "
Also, reading Clarke , seems I can comment some of the time not all of the time as I go to some training

Gruff...can you please refrain from chanting 'Sack Marty'?

Its unhelpful, it hits at the team's (who is 100% behind Marty) morale and is generally bad form.

Add to this, it was done @ home and on a televised match, what is the nation to think of the fanbase?

Thank you in advance.

Marcus, how many times do you need ot be told that the players are not 100% behind the coach before you understand?

The more you spout off about it the less credible you become. I don't know why we bother even responding to you, because you are blind to certain things that we try to helpyou with.

The players are 100% behind the coach IN THE PUBLIC EYE. No more, no less.

Read that too Camel and thought Marty missed the chance to reach out to disgruntled fans and encourage those who booed to harness that passion and support the players when they appear to be struggling.

Something along the lines of "we love the passion of our fans, we walk taller when the crowd is with us and supporting us emotionally, we need them to help us find that extra 10% sometimes, it's so much harder if they don't have our backs"

Instead he has pretty well endorsed people booing in the future on the justification they purchased a ticket.

Poor Marty, can't take a trick.

@triton60 you know this how?

@Marcus Camby.

NO. I'll do what I FEEL is appropriate to the situation, not what you feel is appropriate.

The nation thinks the fanbase (apart from ignorant fools like yourself) is fed up with Marty and they're right.

Than you in advance for respecting my right to express myself.

Clarke : " I don't take it personal . "
The article (sundaymail) also mentions the 3yearplan ,
although weigh lovers are pouring cold water over the fact that it exists.

BJF, do you really think I'm silly enough to answer that question?

The naivete of some on this forum is astounding.

Pretty sure you have no idea what you are talking about. The playing group is the tightest and most committed in 5 plus years of the 36ers.

BJF, pretty sure I do know what I'm talking about. You are welcome to your little fantasy land though.

"The playing group is the tightest and most committed in 5 plus years of the 36ers"

Agreed, the playing group is extremely tight. As for committed, you wouldn't expect any different from professional athletes.

Neither of those points have anything to do with Marty though, but I can see how you would get that impression from the outside looking in.

It seems you consider your self on the "inside" by your choice of words. If so it is highly inappropriate to be on a forum such as this using an alias to spread confidential information, rumour and lies.

Triton60....I AM in the Public.

I have no inside knowledge.

I can only go by what the players say publicly.

Are you saying they are lying to the public?

Propaganda? statements based on facts aren't propaganda.

Statements based on slightly distorted truths and falsehoods are propaganda, i challenge you to find any comment that i have made that is not based on facts.

Lets put it another way which you may understand marus if you hated your boss would you say it in public where he would have a great chance of hearing it.

BJF, you are reading things into my posts which I haven't even said. You're playing a dangerous game there buddy. Don't make stuff up.

I'm not going to bother with this any more, because as 99% of the posters here are trying to point out to you, you clearly have no idea what you are on about.

Marty will be gone soon and I'm sure he won't mind taking you and Marcus with him. Good riddance to all of you.

@Anon'201...

Yes I know what it means when the Board says the coach has our full support.

The Board has not said that about our Head Coach.

So how can you use this example?

@BK...No I would not go out and broadcast that my boss was sh!t.

Conversely I would not broadcast that he is was a good boss and I love working for him either.

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to keep QUIET?

I am left to surmise the playing group loves playing under Marty.

BJF, you are reading things into my posts which I haven't even said. You're playing a dangerous game there buddy. Don't make stuff up.


the interweb is a dangerous place lmao