my take:

PC: once a great defender and athletic slasher, like most NBL players he lost his athleticism in his mid 20s, and with it his lateral quickness that made him a good defender. Loves the big shot, wont crumble under pressure, and works his butt off when all others have given up. Needs to watch his temper and resist berating teammates (even if you cant blame him sometimes). Dead eye 3 point shooter, who is attacking the rim more this season and his 3 pt shot is loving the open looks this provides by giving defenders more to think about. Needs to be this team's leader.

In my opinion Mims is the ultimate passenger, he plays D, doesn’t need the ball, and will get you steals and rebounds. Doesn’t have much of an offensive game, but he’s kind of like a Shawn Marion that can get points quickly. Just needs to stay on the floor and be the glue guy. He’s the guy you want to be the passenger.

Gill: has a huge ego that needs to be kept in check. Must resist trying to outdo the opposing PG and get more guys open. Needs to ignite the fast break more often. Don’t like the way he dominates the ball and eats the shot clock.

M Cedar: Everybody now knows that he is the slowest guard (maybe player) in the league and can just open up the floor for whoever he is guarding. Guys must relish being guarded him. A pure shooter with nothing else. Was once an athletic dunk machine (prior to NBL career) but seems to have lost any hops he once had. Not sure what’s going on there. Shrinks from the big moments too. Apparently works hard at practice but never seen him work hard in a game. Shies from contact, but this season has actually been looking to attack the rim a bit more, with varying results. Just wish his brother would teach him how to play D

M Norton. An undersized PG with a great three point and mid range shot. Smart player, not terribly athletic or quick.

Chris Cedar has a terrible jump shot, great speed and ball handling ability, and a good passer but prone to turnovers. Likes to get guys going and find them in their hot spots. Loves the open court, and has a great penetrate and dish. Not a great finisher yet. Great defender. He’s not young though. He’s 23.

Vandy is what he is: a big lumbering tall timber who can’t really do a whole lot but takes up space and puts in effort on both ends. A great guy to be coming last off the bench.

Allen: has versatility and outside shooting. No post moves. No defense. Can’t rebound. Prone to losing his temper. Weak mind. Not the kind of guy that I could imagine being a bit player. Needs a change of scenery. Remember, Cameron Tragardh was once this soft, lazy and useless, and like Allen, got plenty of chances and kept blowing them before being shipped out of town.

Holmes: his stats speak for themself, but you don’t want him to be your leading scorer. Works hard every game.

Forgot Blanchfield:

Needs to attack harder and be more aggressive. So much potential and length. Great defender already. Needs to get quicker laterally and look to dunk HARDER and really start intimidating people.

Mick, You say Mimms is the ultimate passenger but then say he gives you defence, rebounds, steals and scoring? Sounds like a contradiction. I think Mimms is one of a few Crocs who have played good all year. I just think he needs to watch his fouls and people poking him in the eye.

Michael Cedar is completely crap when he isnt hitting his shots - which is hardly ever away from Townsville. Id limit him to 10 minutes a game until he gets his game together. Ben Allen is the biggest waaste of height Ive seen since Thomas Hamilton.

PC I used to think was a bit lazy, but that has changed in the last couple of years.

I meant Mims isn't a "go to" guy. He'll get his stats within the flow of the game, like a Shawn Marion.

When Trigger was in TSV, he was fat, straight up. Out of shape and didn't work hard. He said he never got a chance, but every time he took to the floor he did something really stupid. He got plenty of chances, and played great in the state league but just went to shit in the NBL until he got shipped out of town.

Sometimes a guy just needs a change of scenery, he's used to failing so that's what he does, it becomes self-fulfilling...

Mick was saying a passenger as in someone who doesnt demand a lot of the ball.

Only problem with the import pairing is that they're both already 32, so there's not much future there.

This is a win-now team that the Crocs have. Crawford ain't getting any younger either. It’s now or never.

There's probably a better term for that sort of player (Saville, Tovey, Vukona) than passenger?

I remember laughing a lot when Trigger played for the Crocs.

When a guy gets in the game and the lead starts reducing drastically because of his direct influence, cramming in turnovers, falling over comically, tripping over his own feet, missing open layups, dunks and missing defensive rotations into short stints, his "chance" is over. He used to cram a lot of damage into his short stings.

Trigger was terrible as a Croc. That's all there is to it. Credit to him to work on getting in shape, getting mentally stronger and starting to play aggressively, and now he's a great NBL player. But that side of his game simply wasnt there in TSV.

Would we love to him now? Sure. But the question is, would he have become the player he was no without a change of scenery, even with lots of minutes? I doubt it. Sometimes guys just need a change.

I definately wouldn't consider mims a passenger either, a role player and worker in the mould of vukona, Dusty and Holmes for sure. Every team should One or two. I just see the first five carrying the rest far too much and it only takes foul trouble or an off shooting night for a couple of the top guys and there is no one stepping up to fill the hole.

The problem is, the GM is the former town high school principal. For those who don't know, Town High is the "basketball" school in the region.

Don't tell me how a school principal is qualified to be a general manager of a sports club, but some idiot deemed it so.

But anyway, he will NEVER give up on M Cedar.

Who knows, when Schensch comes back, that extra "go to" scorer might balance things out? Maybe not though.

Blanchfield does have no fire. I remember him as a young lad, much taller and athletic than his competition, being outduelled by shorter, smarter, harder players on the regular. Guys change though. Just wish he would be looking to EMBARASS people. Because with his length, quickness, shooting ability and hops, he CAN.

The Crocs are in trouble mate. They gave Cedar the captaincy, shows that whoever is calling the shots doesn't have a clue, when he at best is a bunches scorer who should come off the bench, and has not one other tool in his arsenal other than the long range bomb.

Don't get me wrong, they still have a team that can win it all this year - with the parity in the league that is always possible. But it makes you wonder about the management.

Schensch completely changes this team though, you are right. Watch Mims come into his own now the game is opened up.

That is funny Eddie gill is a pass first guy and pass first guys don't have egos that need to be kept in check, he eats the clock because woolpert tells him to, and he is playing hurt and when he shoots it's because woolpert wants him to. I have been following gill since his junior year in school that guy doesn't know what an ego is. And as for the other pg in the NBL Eddie gill isn't worried.

For the Allen vs Vanderjagt people, a season aggregate +/- to date.

Elvin Mims (+45)
Eddie Gill (+21)
Jacob Holmes (+8)
Michael Cedar (+8)
Luke Schenscher (+7)
Ben Allen (+5)
Peter Crawford (+2)
Todd Blanchfield (-4)
Chris Cedar (-20)
Greg Vanderjagt (-46)