If Breakers can keep that inside game going, layups and post ups, they will clean up because they will still get their share from outside. Oscar, CJ and Storey if he's on.

For the Sixers to have half a chance Ballinger, Groves will have to have big, big nights and everyone else will have to chip in.

I just cannot see it being close with Breakers defence dominating.
Lets hope the officials don't have a big one.

I'm thinking the Breakers will torch us. That way, if they do I'm not too disappointed, if they don't it's a nice surprise! I'll need to see a few more solid perfomances on the road (not necessarily wins, although that would obviously be great!) before the Cairns win will feel like much more than a pleasant aberration.

Sixers are good odds at 4 to 1

Right about floor, its pretty average.

3's we still shoot too many, at expense of inside game where we could hurt Sixers bad.

The two wigged guys are foundation fans so I put up with them. I usually watch games with no sound and give my own commentary (always better).

Can't see Hill being a factor. He'll be marked by Abercrombie and Boucher so he won't have too much freedom. Have to get his points from outside. Is he good enough? Especially if they fall behind.

Breakers defense should be too strong for Sixers offense, unless Ballinger, Groves heat up. Stern test for Gilchrist tonight. Expect us to break it open in fourth and win it by 15.

For a team tipped to be run away premiers, NZ have had an unsettled start to the season and are 3-3, same as the Sixers. With Penney making a tentative return tonight, Burston out, ordinary road form by the Sixers, road wins hard to come by and a noisy parachioal Kiwi krowd, how do people rate our chances?

What do we need to do to chalk up a W in enemy territory?

Looking forward to some good matchups. Holmes-Foreman, battle of the guards.

Things to watch:
* Keyways - they seem to be slippery. Last couple of games we've had players slip as they are going for drives into the key. How many will slip tonight?
* "The Noize" - if you're watching the game via Rivus, look for two overweight, middle aged men with wigs banging drums behind the Sixers bench at time outs - they are annoying!
* Three pointers - Breakers luv 'em. They set up around the perimeter and spin that ball until one is free, then up it goes. They are 60/163 and we are 41/123. With the Sixers being smaller on court, will they keep on chucking up 3's, or will they feed?
* "Hill Billy factor" - he grows an extra leg when on the road - hope he's on fire.

I think this will be a tough game tonight, with a scoreline likely to be 89:77 in favour of Breakers, unfortunately.

Last two comments were relocated from a duplicate thread so might be out of context, etc.

The game's on Fox from 4.30 Adelaide time.

6ers wont get within 25 tonight....Breakers are better at everything from the coaching to the hustle plays. I dare them to prove me wrong!!!!

Great to see u contributing again to hoops Big Sexy, how much are u betting on us.

I agree with Bill that our D should get us over the line tonight coupled with the home court advantage. Ballinger will need a massive game and with Rickert showing some form over the last couple of weeks not sure if thats gonna happen. Storey will have a fair bit of confidence going into tonights game

I cannot see us (36ers) winning this one. Doubt Penney will suit but with Burston out it leaves too big a whole & over the Tasman makes it harder. NZ by 12.

I never thought I would ever say this but..... Sixers should start Cooper tonight! We can't have Ballinger guarding Rickert. He is required to focus on offense. If we start Cooper then I think Holmes would need to go to the bench as we will need Hill for scoring. It's a tough Delimma we face made even harder that NZ are a great 3 point team so we cant gamble on double teams with a smaller team.

Hopefully its a good game! I think the Sixers can steal it if we have a good shooting night but I think NZ will be too good and win by about 10

Think we need the "Silver Fox" smack in the middle of the NZ drummers behind our bench.
That will even the game up!

This article suggests that Penney is unlikely to play. 90 minutes until tip-off.

Definately not confident about this one. I don't feel like we will ne annhialated but then again...

Balls needs to step up, he's my boy but he's been way to quiet in the begining of the season.

I'd like to see Gilly create from his penatration rather than settle for outside jumpers tonight. The same with Tez. I think if there is anything we can try to exploit is NZ on ball D. Gilly definately has the leg speed and Hilly can get to the rack too, so if we can drive and dish (to anyone but Cooper, i hate to hate but seriously whens the last time this guy amde a lay-up outside of warmups!) we can rack up points.

King James glad you said before I said it re getting Ballinger out of Centre and hope use Garlepp to help out as well.
We need Ballinger back to best and to score big to get close.
Certainly give us a better idea where we are at.

Balls will step up for sure tonight as he was demoted from captain in my fantasy team. As a result Id expect him to piss me off with a cracking game!

I'm gonna go watch the game but I expect Rickert to hurt us as well. Moving Balls to his natural PF is a good idea, but the problem is that Cooper will get slaughtered by Rickert and I doubt Garlepp has the experience.

Sixers were good shutting down the Breakers perimeter game last time, so they are gonna have to concentrate on keeping the shooters quiet again and hoping Rickert can't win it by himself!

Only saw it was on Fox at 4.16pm... fastest I've packed up and driven home!

1st 3mins 36ers 10 Breakers 15

Live Stats

Someone not named Adam Ballinger is welcome to hit a FG any time now...

Qtr time - 36ers 16 - Breakers 22

Ballinger top scoring for Sixers with 9.
Rickert looking good with 9 too.

Refs have been... interesting. Telling Rickert to stop 'locking up arms on every rebound' amongst other stuff.

Gotta love CJ initiating contact and diving. Apparently it's a 'veteran's call'.

Not a great start by everyone not named Adam.

Balls 4/5 for 9 pts, the rest 0/10 from the field, fortunately they have made 7/8 free throws.

Probably lucky to only be down 6, although I'm only going on live stats, as still at work.

As predicted, Rickert causing all sorts of problems with 11 & 5 in the first.

27% FG% is not a good start for us....Hill inconsistent 4:26 0 pts.........

That goal tending call on Hill was just plain retarded.

3 dunks? to start the 2nd. Down 14. We're getting rolled.

Alley. 4 dunks. 16 points.

0-12 to start the 2nd qtr........not looking good

36ers sucks.

Ninnis is a sad excuse for a coach, SACK HIS INCOMPETENT ASS.

My dick could score 30 against these losers and pull down 15 boards as well, no interior defense at all. How many dunks so for for NZ - 10?

I'm not sure I've ever seen them humiliated this bad. Really.

D.Rose#1 - I suggest you contact TR as he may be intrested in drafting your dick into his fantasy team with those sort of numbers....

Half time- 36ers 31, NZ 49.

I actually lost count on how many highlight reel dunks the Breakers had. 10 or something.

We. Look. Crap.

Painful.

The Sixers, the refs, the coverage.

So painful.

If you are a 36er, please stand up........Consistently Inconsistent!

Sorry Statman, my dick has been retired for nearly 4 years now. Fucking relationships.

"D.Rose#1 - I suggest you contact TR as he may be intrested in drafting your dick into his fantasy team with those sort of numbers...."

HAAAHAAHA! That cheered me up. It's times like these we need Isaac to bring the little balls back.

XztatiK is right - coverage is amatuer hour. Crowd shots during Sixer's offence? C'mon.

Vote now for D.Rose#1's dick for the HOF.

Hey. He's not Rob Rose... but he has my vote.

I totally forgot... Mum is touring NZ by car at the moment. Wonder if she'll start the second half to inject some offence.

Or defence.

...

...or anything.

Ok. Gilly steal, break, 2 and 1 (on CJ) isn't a bad start.

You know youy are in trouble when Ronaldson leads the transition and penetrates the lane!!!
Schoolboy defence giving up somany dunks.
Offence stagnant 1 on 5.
How do you get some respect back after that half?
Gilchrist shaky.
Groves looks assured just can't buy a basket.

First play of game what a misread. Ballinger marked by Boucher, no post up. on ball screen right into Boucher, dumb play.

2nd Qtr was dreadful... I totally feel sorry for you sixer fans

LOL Ninnis must have really gotten into them (sarcasm)...NZ start the quarter with an offensive rebound and put back and then a soft lay up.

'Tez looking better.

5 point game. Dare I hope? Gilly looking real good.

OH. HELL. YEAH!!!

Where did this come from?

Bill, you've gone quiet?

YEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!

What a quarter!!!!

Holy crap my dogs are scared because I'm going crazy here!

GO YOU SIXERS!!!

35 - 15 3rd Quarter!! C'MON!!!

The Breakers had OUR third quarter fade away - how dare they deny us the opportunity!

Did we just play.... defence?

These refs are a joke. CJ just dragged Pitbull down by the jersey when he fell over, then Boucher just bodyslammed him. No foul.

Massive three from CJ with 1 sec left.

BIGGER 3 from Herbert to reply!!

Up 3 with 6mins to play... c'mon Sixers.

(Refs are beyond bad).

Dear CJ - quit flopping. Ballinger just kicked your ass.

That was CRAP. 'Tez stripped CJ clean and CJ kicked it! Ugh.

I am SO FREAKING sick of CJ initiating contact and gettig the call. Oscar nominee for the crap. Lowry HOF nominee.

Q4 foul count 6:2 their way- home court advantage?

How tough is Holmes? Massive rebound when it counted.

Up 3 - Sixer's ball. Little over 2 mins to play.

1:27 left, we are up by 3

Correction - 1.24

My post correction, not yours Jack.

YEAH!!! PITBULL!!! C'mon!! Finish!!

25 sec left, up by 2 "23, Cj Bruton, foul unsportsmanlike" looks like Gilly knocking down free shots and we get the restart.

Sink 'em

Steal of the year by Pitbull!

He's got that look back. Thank GOD Gilchrist has that look back.

John Gilchrist, freethrow made
John Gilchrist, freethrow made
John Gilchrist, foulon
Cj Bruton, foul unsportsmanlike 79-81 -2
Cj Bruton, turnover ballhandling 79-81 -2
John Gilchrist, steal
John Gilchrist, shot 2pt made

What more can you say??!!

Credit CJ. That is pedigree right there. OT.

CJ just missed a 3, got his rebound and hit a 3, scores tied...

SHIT!

How did Tez miss that layup??? How did we just let that happen???

OT

why couldnt cortez just make that layup?

CJ 3.

Call travel again, you stupid jerks. That only makes about 9 of them.

Travel? TRAVEL????

Kiwi refs are on par with Kiwi coverage. Ugh.

anon, it was a layup you geezer, you take a layup if you get it. better than freethrows... usually.

'Home court calls'. Even Kiwi commentators called it. Way to get 'em home. Pathetic.

Saw the first half, saw the last 1.30 in regular and the O/T - don't blame the refs for the poor offence, the poor shot selection and the missed shots.

Oh don't get me wrong, Sixers blew it. We should have closed in regular time. Our fault.

Still doesn't mean I'm impressed with the calls.

Hill should of got the free throws to make four point in normal time

Did he actually just tell Pitbull to "speed up your free throw shooting, you've only got five seconds" at the end of a close game? Did I dream that? Are you serious you bald prick?

so close yet so far

Why the hell didnt groves just throw it down!? He was wide open and screwed it up coz he was torn between dunk and layup.

XztatiK, milking the clock would be preferable than missing and open layup.

Sixers lose. ugh.

I have been to that stadium and seen us screwed over by the refs and looks like the same thing has happened again. Sickening!

What can I say? It's shit like that that makes you proud to have Phil Haines.

Unbelievable. Just replayed that missed layup. Can't understand it. Sooo frustrating after that huge comeback.

We werelucky to get out of jail on that one.

Disappointing display by Breakers that we could not repel the Sixers challenge in that 3rd quarter and even worse that it was a CJ, Abercrombie show in the 4th shooting from the perimeter and we just got lucky at the end to get OT.

Sixers would have won some lost fans back with their second half. Thought Hill was outstanding.

"XztatiK, milking the clock would be preferable than missing and open layup."

Don't think they would've fouled numbnuts?

Just replayed the CJ three. Both Holmes and Balls were in front of him on that shot. Neither bothered to get a hand up. Holmes has an excuse because he went over to cover Oscar in the corner but Balls was just guarding the paint (when we're 3pts down). Dumb.

We get screwed at the Dome, not away teams.

Just saw the poll on NBL.com.au. About the travel call this year. Can't understand how people are voting "yes" to that. They are ruining the game by calling travels that aren't there and why? To act superior to the NBA which allows slight walks? To make it even harder for imports to make the transition? Or to get in line with international/Euro basketball, when even they allow a hell of a lot more than the NBL does now? Sick of it.

cut cortez please......he cost us that game, him alone. Missed wide open lay up, so much for the tez a few years back who actually had some hops. Secondly the poor D and foul on Abercrombies drive, then he decides im none for what 5? ill jack another pull up 3.....BRICK. Some the piece of Sh#t off and put somebody else on please!!!!!!. Cortez is a cancer on his bad nights, he continues to shoot and miss killing what should have been a massive comeback win. Ill admit he has been ok so far, but this is my point. Inconsistent and does not know when to stop shooting, resulting in costing us the game. CUT TEZ, garbage.

Just got home from the pub. First I want to say GREAT COMEBACK Sixers. They at least showed progress from the Melbourne and Perth games where they just laid down and died. Much better response this time around.

In the end though, the game was there to be won and we made too many errors. X, you're absolutely right about Balls not closing CJ out for that tying three. That was terrible. As CJ was coming up the court I was silently screaming for the defenders to come right out to the three point line and as soon as he got his man on his hip I KNEW he was going to take a deep three in rhythm. Could Balls not see that? C'mon! Let the guy blow you for two - who cares - just don't allow CJ to take a three point shot in rhythm like that. Aaaargh!

The other HORRIBLE error was Groves blowing the layup. Can't believe he missed that. That was the game right there! I've been trying to defend the guy, but after tonight he has convinced me he can't hit the side of a barn with mack truck! I'm not expecting Julius Hodge, but we need an import that can make a few jump shots!

Anyhow, thats my drunken rant... might say something more coherent later when I've looked at the box score!

Good calls all around Beantown.

Dreamteam scores for those interested:

Gilchrist: 68
Tez: 18
Hill: 28
Balls: 34

Bruton: 46
Abercrombie: 44
Ruckert: 30
Storey: 18

F***!! The first half of this game was arguably the worst I have seen a 36ers side play. Other than Ballinger, there was no offence whatsoever. We could not buy a field goal and only free throws kept us scoring. Our defence was even worse and anybody that wants to argue that Cooper is a good defensive player that is worth his lack of offensive needs their head read. How many times can he leave his player unattended around the basket? How many fouls does he give away coz he's out of position?

The third quarter goes to show how schizophrenic this team really is. This is not the most talented team we have ever had, but there's definitely talent there to be used. What the hell happens to our motivation and our mental state sometimes? The third goes to show that they can get the job done but in its own way, the third quarter comeback is an example of exactly why this team is so frustrating to support. Do we know what consistency means?

This game was always more likely to be won by New Zealand, but we totally wasted our chances. Missing free throws at crucial times is unforgivable for professionals and missing a layup that would have sealed the game is even more frustrating. Which brings me to Groves. I really hope we're not wasting much money on him, because he is the most frustrating of the bunch. Has all the talent he needs, but what the hell is he thinking? 1 of 11, is he crazy? He just keeps shooting, tries to keep busting through solid defense too early in the offence. GET A CLUE!

Oh yeah, the refs and CJ Bruton. We'll just reinvoke the Andrew Gaze law for him. Anything he goes near turns to gold in the eyes of the refs. How many times does he have to flop, inhibit the offence and get away with it? Heard of a block anyone?

Bottom line - worst first half ever, great comeback which gives the fans heart, but it really is difficult to be a 6ers fan at the moment!

C'mon. We've seen Michael Jordan miss uncontested dunks/lay ups and lose a bunch of games. Cut him some slack.

Like I said elsewhere, I'm as pissed as everyone else, but putting it ALL on 'Tez ain't fair.

Seen the box scores, and had we shot rasonably we would have won by 15.
Only 22% from downtown, and we had the better inside when we decided to go there which wasn't very often in the second half.Rickert another solid outing. CJ 27 but took and missed a lot. Abercrombie nearly there. Bear efficient. Probably boards just made up for poor shooting.

Gilchrist shot well, and pulled Sixers back into it. But still not very impressed with ball handling and decision making. Poor Groves, got fouled a couple of times on drives but couldn't get a call and had another miserable night.
Holmes Mr Steady. Ballinger steady but needs room to operate. Tried giving the up fake that no one bought and got into trouble.

Unfortunately 3 home referees. Hate to see a different game refereed here to Australia.

Then again, I agree with every single thing quasi posted.

Tez isn't the only one at fault, but was the only one that didn't contribute to the second half comeback. They were all bad except Ballinger (and even then only on offence) in the first half. But teams do tend to rely on their imports being quality. Look at how Gilchrist responded. Tez's heart doesn't seem to be in it any more and his game so far this season has been nothing like it used to be. Needs to improve in a major way to at least be consistent across matches. I'm not saying he has to get 20 points every week, but shooting above at 30% would be nice. His shot selection is very questionable at the moment, I would say.

Yeah, all fair points.

Winning over there will always be difficult. I was expecting 89:77, so to draw 84:84 at full time is a good result.

It is disappointing that some plays didn't go our way, but at least it wasn't a Perth result.

Watch out Satdee...

MVP Points:
Where do you get the Dreamteam scores from X?

My ranking would be:

Gilly (45)
Balls (24)
Groves (22)
Holmes (21)
Hill (17)
Cooper (7)
Ng (2)
Herbert (1)

After looking at the box, what happened to the Ninja?

Didn't see Ng injured or anything - Scotty just sat him down. Only came on when it was long range prayer time. Which has bugged me for longer than I can remember.

Jack, just added them up from the box.

I said this about Tez from the start, but you all shot me down. Hate to say it but told you so.

Vanexel31 - I thought the same, but then moved on to wishful thinking! Don't think that that's working at the moment..........Maybe Davidson would have been a better signing to balance out the point instead of being overloaded at the 2, in hindsight

lucky to scrape home but we'll take that. yeah some questionable calls but it's not like the Breakers get a lot of love from the refs when they are on the road.
there are always going to be games like that. Abercrombie played well and Storey had a nice volley ball spike block. heaps of dunks, Pledger was effective.

Would have been an exciting night at North Shore, no doubt.

I think we need a reliable back up centre rather than a back up PG right now. I love Davo, one of my favourate players ever but with Burston injury prone past we need more than Cooper for insurance. If we cut groves maybe we could get Larry Abney or someone similar and have Burston come off the bench?

I think that signing Cooper again was just an awful move. He didn't give us anything last season and has decreased his output to making errors instead of offering nothing. I sort of feel bad saying that coz he's a really nice guy, but that certainly doesn't help on court. We could have had a better back up C instead of Coops and then had room to have an extra PG as well instead of too many SG's. We struggle too much when Gilchrist is on the bench coz we don't have another legitimate ball carrier. Burston was always meant to be a starter. He's meant to be back in a week or so, so hopefully that will sort out some of the problems at the 5

Abney, are you serious? Yeah, start him with Brad Hill, see how well that goes down. Sure to provide some team cohesion for sure...

Wow, glad they only lost in overtime, on the road. Imagine the dramas on here if they didn't have a great second half. I was happy to see a good contest, dominant second quarter from NZ, then a huge third quarter from the 36ers plus the exciting finish. Mistakes from players from both sides, but that's basketball.

Xztatic - sixers should have held the ball up when up by 4. If Ninnid didn't give that instruction, it's bad coaching. If Cortez was told that but shot the ball anyway, it's on him. Up four, two possesion game. Just get the ball to your free throw shooters. Game over.

Just being passionate about our team Isaac! The fightback was great as previously stated, but improvements have to happen to get some consistency. Areas of weakness need to be identified. We can't be happy with playing well for half a game - that's why we lost. The 6ers have passionate, emotional fans, that's why they have the most consistent crowds in the league.

Yes, absolutely no emotion at all until the game is completely over. Let him go - he had some great moments in that game.

quasi, sure and obviously in 36ers-Breakers games, one of my teams will always win so I'm not distraught by any stretch, but they showed some determination on the road and there were more than a few good signs in there.

thedoctor, sorry but in that situation we had last night, you absolutely take the free two points. The only advantage to not shooting is shaving time off the clock and if Groves didn't shoot that, I guarantee he would have been fouled within a couple more seconds. So for the sake of a couple of seconds, why force yourself to make two free throws when you could make a layup instead?

Anon, if you think Brad Hill is a scrub, you know nothing about basketball. After Ballinger he is already the best pure scorer on this team. He is also by far the most likely Aussie player on the Sixers to take that next step to being a star in the league. The only thing that has held him back is lack of court time due to injuries. If he stays healthy for the rest of this season, he will almost certainly be one of the teams top three scorers along with Balls and Gilchrist.

About last night, it was disappointing to see the Sixers throw the game away late, but I'm willing to accept a few growing pains as long as Scotty and the players contiue to learn from their mistakes.

Judging by last night's peformance, they have already made progress from the Perth and Melbourne games. Gilchrist and Holmes in particular stood out to me during the comeback for their determination, passion and ability to execute good plays.

If we take care of business and beat Cairns Saturday night then we will be okay. I think most of us expected to lose to the Breakers and beat Cairns this week right?

So if we win Saturday then we are 4-4. Burston is due back perhaps next week and should make a massive difference to our team balance. I see us continuing to be a bit uneven throughout the season, but I think with Burston back we will make the finals and that will be a good step forward for a club that has been struggling for the last 4 years.

Agreed Isaac, pretty poor quality game. Don't know what the Breakers were celebrating at end of game.
Cashed in our get out of jail free card last night.
Hard to see us threatening Perth or Woolongong after that. When the 3's dry up we don't seem to have the composure to adjust. 18% is not going to get it done against better teams.
Worse was giving up 35 points in a quarter. Usually the only way a team gets that is if they are red hot, making runaway lay ups or score 18 points at the line. I didn't see any of those senarios.
And we should have broken the momentum by going inside getting two or to line.
I feel more deflated after that than if we had lost.

There was some poor shooting in various stages, but that was a great game of basketball. Very high intensity and I cant remember the last time I had so many 'wow' moments watching a game at any level. Not only the dunks but some tough shots and great passing, particularly by the Breakers in the first half.

Thoroughly enjoyed it, and the Sixers lost it with their terrible transition defence in the second quarter. The stuff at the end happens in close games, but it should never have been that close.
Sixers really missed Burston, but for NZ every win without Penney and with an underperforming import is like gold.

The third quarter was full of great plays - they came back from what was previously a 24-point deficit and won that quarter 35-15 on the road. Every moment of your job doesn't have to be some entirely joyless slugfest. He was hardly dancing a jig after every rebound, just celebrating what were a succession of great plays. It's not like he's smirking or talking down the opposition - he's celebrating success for him and his team.

If he were smirking, that's a different story - I'm not really a fan of that style of player either - but he hasn't been. The game needs flavour. It needs Hinder, Worthington, Heal, Rickert, the nicknames, the mohawks, the tattoos, etc.

"Xztatic - sixers should have held the ball up when up by 4. If Ninnid didn't give that instruction, it's bad coaching. If Cortez was told that but shot the ball anyway, it's on him. Up four, two possesion game. Just get the ball to your free throw shooters. Game over."

Doc, I had a nice explanation ready for you but Beantown just ruined it:P. He pretty-much covered it, Tez would've been fouled straight away by Storey, if he had stayed where he was and dribbled on the spot he probably would've used up even less of the clock than he did taking the layup, and 99.9% of the time a wide-open layup is a better option than two free-throws. Certainly not bad coaching or a bad decision on Cortez's behalf, there's not a player on the team who wouldn't have made the same decision.

Anon, you can't be serious. Showing a bit of emotion and firing his teammates up like that was essential in that comeback and shutting the opposition crowd up. Unless I missed something that you saw I can't see how anyone would have a problem with his actions in that third.

Agreed Isaac - more needed to get the league pumping again. More Williams v Robbins type media trash talk would be good too.

The one moment I've seen (first hand or televised) of Gilchrist this year that I haven't really liked was in the Tigers game when he was lying on the court (I swear Hodge did it once too) having a sulk and other aspects of attitude in that game. Presumably there was some more in the Perth game too. Aside from that, he's done pretty well and his enthusiasm has been new and almost unique in what's otherwise a pretty vanilla team.

Meanwhile, after Groves was lying on the court in the Breakers game, turns out he's seeing a doctor about a possible broken/fractured cheekbone after copping the elbow from Brad Hill (who's already busted Burston's hand - awful luck!).

Xztatic - last night's result shows why holding the ball up is the better option. You make your free throws, even 1 os OK, and then you have time to set your D and prevent a quick score, call a time out if necessary.

I wouldn't say 99.9% of lay-ups are made at any point of a game, let alone in a pressure situation (it wasn't an open court lay-up by any means)

How can you argue your point when last night's result clearly supports mine? The point isn't the missed lay-up - it's the late game tactics that should have denied NZ the chance to tie. If Tez pulls that ball out, no missed lay-up, no quick score, game over.

Beantown - the crucial point is the quick score allowed by the Sixers after the missed lay-up. That's what would have been stopped if the ball had been pulled out. Even one free throw would be enough (would have put us up by 5 with less than 20 secs left), time out could be called to get the subs right, and to set a good defence.

I'm sorry, but on your tactics Sixers lose (it actually happened!). On my tactics they win.

Three posts in a row - sorry. I grant that there is some risk in missing free throws in a deliberate foul game. But, even if we make one, NZ have to score twice, including at least one three, against set defence without us scoring again. Highly unlikely.

Again, the quick score by NZ turned the game into a one-possession game and CJ did the rest.

Yeah, that was a bit of a knock. They were worried about concussion at one stage, so he was probably seeing double on that layup, and went for the wrong bucket.

Ok doc, that's your opinion but I think most intelligent people involved in basketball would disagree. If there is no difference in seconds passed, a layup is a more effective option than taking the foul (there is also the chance of a 3pt play in this situation btw). It was a freak of nature-type fluke of a miss by Tez last night but give me that situation again and I'd take the layup every time.

As for setting the defence after free-throws, I think the big 3 by CJ showed that's not always the case (that happened after a FT), even after the Cortez miss, it was 3 on 3 in the Breakers' frontcourt, we weren't out of position or unprepared on D, it was a great play by Abercrombie.

Think we'll have to agree to disagree here mate, I'd love to coach against you sometime, maybe a game of NBA Live :P

Hang on - am I missing something here? The sixers did exactly what you advise as the best strategy and lost.

Would you include Cortez Groves and Scott Ninnis as "intelligent people involved in basketball"? Bet they both like my strategy at the moment.

Doc, now you're getting silly. As I said, it was a freak miss by Cortez and that's where my 'strategy' fell apart. I would put my life on him making that any other time and for that reason I guarantee you Ninnis and Tez would make the same decision next time.

In all seriousness, lay-ups are not a given. Like I said, pull the ball out, make one free throw and the Sixers win that game.

In that situation, up four with the ball - the Sixers don't need to score to win the game. Their focus is to hit free throws, force NZ into tough shots. That's it.

It wasn't a 'freak miss'. Players miss relatively easy lay-ups all the time.

Doc, that was probably the easiest shot I've ever seen missed in NBA/NBL basketball.

If making shots like that aren't a given, then why are we paying these guys again? That was a freak miss - possibly explained a little if Groves was indeed concussed at the time - but under normal circumstances anyone who can play basketball would expect to make that shot every time!

As far as the second part of your justification goes - that NZ scored down the other end because of the miss - Xztatik already nailed it. Whats to stop them scoring just as easily off a missed FT? Nothing!

In other circumstances I would totally agree that he should have held the ball and waited to get fouled, but with an easy chance to make it a 6 point lead, he made the right decision, but got an epic fail for his execution.

From memory there was actually some defence being plsyed? (I havnt had a replay just from what I remembr watching live)

I recall seing Groves catch the pass, dribble and go at the hoop with intent, then IMO he 2nd guessed himself - probably thinking 'no pull it out and run the clock' but he was too committed by then with the defense was almost on him so he went up for the layup and stuffed it. If he backed himself 100% from the start he would have dunked it...but he didnt.

Im with the doc on this one though - if I was the coach my instruction everytime is spread the floor and play keepers off, if you do it properly you can actually run significant time off the clock before being fouled.

Oh well - lets look at the positives, the team showed they have the ability, just a pity they needed to be ot of the game before they clicked. Cairns 'should' be a nice confidence boost for them as they really are crap :)

Statman,
quick question: what's the car in your pic? is it a JGS?

Yes Jack - Its a green JGS - my toy ;)

http://linky.com.au/dfec2

"A random survey of NBL and WNBL coaches returned a near-unanimous verdict - they would not have taken the shot but instead run down the clock, knowing the Breakers had to foul.

"On the inbounds pass, I'd have instructed the ball go into the backcourt, thereby using up five or six valuable seconds," one coach said.

"They're going to foul you so you go to the line.

"The only way you could lose from four up and with possession is to turn it over." Or miss."

Ninnis did back the early shot option, but I have to wonder if it is more a case of publicly backing his player? It's interesting that every other coach, NBL and WNBL, would have preferred to have drawn the foul.

I didn't get to see the replay of this incident until the other night. I Can't believe he missed the layup! However I am wondering why he didn't dunk the ball. I see this guy doing 360's in warm ups surely he could easily go up and dunk it with two hands! It was a horrible sequence of plays by the Sixers! We should have won that game.

I remember on the same court when Smyth was coaching we were down by 5 with about 40 seconds to go. Smyth instructed his players to hit a 3 and then foul immediately. We hit the 3 and with 32 seconds left down by only 2 we fouled Penney to give him two shots instead of trying to get the stop on defence. In that case that was a horrible coaching decision, in the most recent case it was just unlucky he missed the layup (or attempt to dunk it instead)

thedoctor, I'd guess that to be the case. Not as though he'd want to put even more pressure on Cortez.

KJ, that's not really a horrible coaching decision. Might be hard to get a stop if they look to dribble out the clock and score off a broken play (as the defense tries to double team). Fouling Penney quickly gives time for two solid responses from Adelaide. Most he'll get from two trips to the line is 3-4 points whereas the extra time allows Adelaide two decent attempts from the arc. Obviously different strategies could be employed, but it's hardly "horrible".

I 100% agree with thedoctor - Cortez should have pulled it out - for the simple fact that if he misses and they go down and get a quick score then they can get back in the game ... and what happened.

Thanks doc,

That's surprising and I'm wondering how anyone could complete a reliable survey in that short space of time but I'll give you that.

Good to see Ninnis is still sticking by the layup if it's there. I'd love to see the same situation happen again.

I'd also like to see these survey results if Tez had taken the foul and missed both free-throws (not very likely but more likely than missing the layup), to lose the game in the same way. I doubt these results would be quite the same.

My reading of the 'survey' (most likely an ad-hoc series of phone calls from Boti to the various coaches?) is that it was a general tactical question, rather than a reference to the specific play.

Anyone else think it's possible Boti read Xztatic and I arguing over the play and decided to do the survey? Or that the play was being discussed at length in basketball circles? I've never seen a journo survey coaches over the tactics of a specific play before.

Reminds me of when Fisher hit the three to tie the game against the Magic in last year's finals. Two schools of thought over whether you defend the play straight up, or foul early and make it a free throw shooting comp.

Yeah, Boti reads the forum, but the "he gets his ideas from here" crew need to understand that, like us, he's a basketball fan. So discussing that play isn't unique to this forum - people talk about it elsewhere, in person, around the traps, etc.

Hi Boti! :P

No, wasn't suggesting he trawls Hoops for ideas. Rather that our discussion got a quite heated and showed two genuine approaches to the last play discussed in some depth, and that maybe Boti saw the merit in both and was interested in what coaches had to say.

alternatively, the play was being discussed at length around the traps and this motivated the 'survey'.

That was good doc, lol, haven't had a real argument on here since EC was at her best (or worst). Guess I gotta give you the win too (that hurts). But I'll still stick by my layup every time.

I've had one or two showdowns with EC too, and a couple with Cecil Exum! If you take Cecil Exum's initials and reverse them you get ...... EC!!!!!
Coincidence?

...I think not.

The free throw debate is academic.

The real problem for the Sixers was the Breakers inbounds play after Hill made his second.
They fronted the unbound pass and CJ was able to take ball almost at half heading downcourt. In fact there were 3 Sixers fronting the inbounds and those 3 players were left behind the ball.
This only left 2 Sixers in front of CJ. CJ's task would have been a little harder had he had to go baseline to 3pt line.
He still may have made shot but it would have been harder.

Statman,

N I C E C A R !!!!!