And perhaps proves that the best way for an Aussie to get to the NBA is via College?

The 2 longest serving Aussies, both big men, Longley & Bogut, were highly rated NCAA players.

Bogut is the best and totally underused by his Milwaukee team the guy could be 20-10 with more than 5 shots a game. Looking at you Michael Redd....

Andrew Gaze is by far and away the best Aussie baller in history.

At the end of his career Bogut may reach the echelon, but his performances on the world stage have been WAAAAAYYYYYYY short of Gaze's.

Its been pretty difficult for Jawai from the moment he was drafted, because he is clearly a long term project as an NBA player and none of the teams that have held his rights so far has been interested in investing the time in him.

It must be a real downer bouncing from team to team with no-one showing any love. He needs a good agent to find him a team that is willing to spend the time on him. I just hope it happens soon and that this stuff doesn't mess with his confidence and enthusiasm for playing basketball.

Guys, bit of a pointless argument as to whether Gaze or Bogut is the best Aussie baller in history. They are two totally different players, so you can't compare them that way.

A better way to look at it is that Gaze is clearly the most decorated player Australia has produced, primarily because of his exploits at intl and NBL level, but also because he continues to be an excellent ambassador for the sport.

But Bogut is deserving of a huge amount of respect too, because he has blazed a trail for Aussies over in the US by showing that we can produce players who not only compete, but can be dominant! On top of that, the publicity for Australian basketballers that he brought by going #1 overall has been immense.

He has gone on to be a solid pro, is one of the better centres in the NBA (behind Yao, Howard & Jefferson for sure, but not many others I'd take ahead of him) and still has room to improve if he can stay healthy in future.

The reason kids wanted to be like Gaze was due to the popularity of basketball when Gaze was in his prime. Basketball was killing it. It was the hottest ticket getting around. The league was marketed and promoted and Gaze benefitted greatly from this (and rightly so) and was the face of the league.

In todays time, basketball is a minority sport with little promotion and marketing in Australia, this includes the NBL and NBA. If Bogut was around in the early 1990's then I think you'd find Bogut would be just a popular, if not more popular than Gaze due to his NBA status.

How did this turn into a Gaze v Bogut discussion?

Paul, if you want to post the 'Gaze is the best argument', find other threads dedicated to the subject.

However, Bogut has been solid, bodering on excellent at times, but thisc past season lost alot of momentum with the injuries.

Jawai's performances in the summer league by reports were disappointing, with one reporter stating that he would struggle in the NCAA!

Beantown your comments about Jawai are spot on. Saves me writing it.

He can play - but no love!!

shin splints, I was simply responding to a previous comment. Hope I didnt offend your sensitivities.

Anon, 99% of your argument is a waste of my time. The point I was arguing was that you can't compare whether Gaze or Bogut is the best basketballer in Aussie history. They are totally different players with different skillsets and facing different challenges.

Gaze was an amazing international player and had a great NBL career, but he never had the athleticism or strength to have a successful, long term NBA career like Bogut.

Bogut is the first guy Australia ever produced that is capable of matching up with NBA quality players on a nightly basis. He can rebound, defend, pass and score like no other Aussie big man to this day. Most of the time he is a solid NBA starter and has had many big games against top players, eg:

20 pts 14 reb 3 blo >65% FG v Duncan 35% FG, 6 reb
20 pts 9 reb v Boston's front line
18 pts 12 reb v Biedrins

Thats just in 33 games last year. Lots of other good games in previous years. Yeah, he had trouble with hall of fame bound Shaq last year, but you try defending the basket against Shaq AND Stoudemire when you're sidekick is a combo of Elson, Gadzuric & Mbah a Moute!

Oh yeah, and as well as being the 2nd international player to be drafted #1, he was also good enough to win in 2004-05:
Consensus National Player of the Year
Wooden Award
Naismith Award
Associated Press First Team All-American
ESPN.com Player of the Year
Sports Illustrated Player of the Year

They are massive achievements by anyone, let alone an Aussie so I can't see why you think he 'isn't even close to Gaze's level' as a basketball player. Do you want to take bets on how long it will take for another Aussie to come along that is good enough to win all those awards?!?!

I just think it would be a lot smarter to show both Gaze AND Bogut some respect for being exceptional, but very different basketball players facing different challenges in their careers.

p.s. - TR, I agree with your point too.

Jawai is not in a good position at the moment for sure. Not sure which team he would be best suited to though.

"eg. Gaze played more international games than MJ, so what does that mean? mmm"

Anon, that's because America did not send pros for the first 8 years of MJ's career.

Back on the Topic of Jawaii - maybe a trade to a young rebuilding team such as Minnesota?
Backup behind Big Al and Love?

Or perhaps Washington - Not great depth at the big spots...

Ditto for Atlanta...Behind Horford, Pachulia, Smith and Smith...

Even a team like the Thunder, rebuilding around young guys, and a raw big man to the mix and in 3-5 years they could be strong.

Any others? I think there would be a lot of good situations out there if he were given the chance...

Would not mind him at The Bulls. Learn from Brad Miller.

Just anyone who'll give him a chance to play!

"Jawai is not in a good position at the moment for sure."

I'd hardly say that a guaranteed $736,420 is not a good position! If he is smart he will be able to set himself up for life with his two years of NBA salary. But I suppose it is all about perspective - from a basketball / playing perspective he doesn't appear to be in a great spot.

Let's be honest.....Jawai isn't that good.

Yes, he's a big unit, with a big upside, but he just isn't NBA calibre at the moment.

Other than a good NBL rookie season with Cairns, what has he actually physicaly done on the court to make anyone think he's NBA ready?

I still can't believe some of the junk he was throwing at the hoop in that series against NZ and that was against big's who aren't even on the international radar!

(Btw, anyone who thinks big Nate's post game in the NZ series was anything other than ordinary at best is kidding themselves.)

Let's not let the fact that he is Australian blur the fact that his ability does not warrant an NBA roster spot.

Maybe he should go to Europe for a couple of years and develop his game and then try the NBA.

Other big guys in the past have headed to Europe for a few years and returned to the NBA better players for it. Marc Jackson & Ike Austin (before he got his big contract and became fat & lazy) come to mind and I'm sure there are quite a few more.

It couldn't hurt.

Even to the Rockets or Bucks as backups to our other Aussies!!!

Jawai certainly performed at the Stankovic Cup. Give him time, he is only young and wouldn't have even been considered as an NBA talent if not for the talent scouts who followed him around Oz for a year.

So in saying that they must have seen something in him to be picked up in the draft.

Think of the millions who play in the US and don't get drafted each year. He is already a winner.

Jawai didn't play in the Stankovic cup.

Was it the pre tourny? The weeks prior he was scoring in the 20's, or was that against the Kiwi's?

He had some good scoring numbers against NZ but the team performed poorly and he copped a bit of criticism for the way he played. I actually wonder if it's all gone to his head a bit - if so, really risks going from team to team and not meeting his full potential. Just speculating though.

Hopefully he can make the grade.

I think AJ Ogilvy is the next star of Australian bball.

He could play in some teams off the bench but needs a big man coach who can give him training time and a player to learn from like Zach Randolph with Rasheed Wallace. He would be best served though following David Andersen and brad millers roads via Europe. Probably get as well paid, court time with same quality players as NBA. If he was to continue the NBA path after being waived he would have to be on crack. Mills should also head to Europe. Won't turn any heads getting 1 minute a game

Jawai needs court time and in the NBA he just isn't going to get any in the short to medium term. I too think his best bet may well lie in europe at this point in time. But as he has a contract, he will likely stay in the US for the up-coming season and migrate between his team and the D-League.

FWIW I think that Gaze is Australia's best ever basketballer. For reasons stipulated already - international record, most decorated. I wish he had of got more of a chance when he was younger to play in the show. Always a role for highly skilled sharp shooters and his passing was great too. The other thing with Gaze was that he probably connected with a lot of people here. He almost looked as far away from a professional basketballer as you can get and the average Joe took heart - if he can make it then I'll give it a go too. I know I certainly took heart from it and ended up playing state ( A while ago now - I'm 32 ) as a 6'3" non-athletic bloke who learn't to make the best of what he had. Him and he fish we're the inspiration........ Getting to Jawai this is exactly why I want him to succeed. He'd be an inspiration to a lot of people... Another generation.... Patty Mills even more so, I'm confident he'll make it though and quite possibly end up as one of Australia's greatest ever basketballer when his career is done