refs are bad now.....not sure what will be worse when parents ref their child or refs now....

i was thinking along the same lines as whistle blower..except the opposite end of the spectrum. There is a shortage of refs...but the shortage is reffering to height and this is because they are 12 year olds or 13 year olds and their umpiriing older u/16 and u/18 boys games. Im all for the green shirt policy but a 12/13 year old umpiring an u18 mens game for instance is unfair for both parties involved. Lets get the older refs doin the higher age groups, as MOST are capable

(#125959)It really depends on the ref. I have a 13 y.o child who has refed u20's div 3 and has done it well & with confidence a number of times.

Dont judge the refs on their age or hieght; judge them on the job they do, good or bad. Some refs are way ahead of others despite their age. This may have something to do with the number of years and level that these young refs have played.

oh yes, please share them around!

yogee,

Why is it that players can get yelled at and not quit?

Perhaps if the UIC's were doing some coaching of the ref's there wouldn't be as much complaining!

high 5 those refs who bag players when they stuff up a shot.... how do you like them apples

Players are conducting an open skill. While umpires are conducting a closed skill.

How would umpires go if somebody was defending them when they were trying to make calls?

How do you like that shoe in your mouth?

Perhaps we should also adopt less political correctness by not making refs demi gods and untouchable.
Green shirts aside bad calls deserve the whistles and shouts from the stands and its double standards to yell abuse/suggestions and well intentioned advice at the refs at sixers/lightning games in front of all and sundry and be expected to watch Div 1 games won and lost by substandard reffing and not vocalise your discontent.
Is district div 1 the elite level? If it is what the hell are 13 year olds doing reffing U16/18/20 games?
IMO basketball players are treated aggressively by coaches, yelled at, put down and generally ticked off when they undeperform so why the hell are we so precious about the umpires that we tolerate this zero tolerance to criticism?
Good umpiring deserves credit and poor umpiring deserves criticism. Pointing out your perceptions of the standard of refs is a fair cop especially as umps get paid and the junior players dont!
By not being able to say boo to the zebras, a lot of umps have developed attitudes way beyond their ability to perform and silence further protects their incompetence. If there are not enough then let the players umpire the game, it is not ideal but 12 and 13 year old kids controlling district div 1 teams at 16/18/ 20, could they be any worse?

Reffs are not Gods. This business of telling people they will be evicted for yelling travel to senior reffs is crap. I pay my money to watch my children play and feel victimised by reffs who think they are God. I do not question all calls or even some really bad ones, but when something happens that gets under my skin I have the right to express that in a non abusive way. Get off the grass reffs and use common sense.

FM get your facts right. Firstly no one said anything about abusing reffs. If you see a travel and call out travel is that abuse? I think not. Secondly in my post I said a senior reff not a thirteen year old. Sounds like you are a reff trying to justify your ego power trip. Thirdly it costs $3 for a spectator. Shows you don't pay to get in. No one goes to the game to question all calls made by a reff but if you say something that is non abusive as one word " Travel" what gives the demigods the right to threaten you with eviction. I am sure we all like to be right all the time but none of us are so expect people to question some decisions in a non-threatening manner and as I said get off the grass.

FM what are you smoking? You are a reff that is for sure and it is attitude like yours that makes things personal. "they are threatening you because it's the 15th time you have done it" shows how you make your calls. Anticipation. I was told the first time so shows that you do not know but are anticipating. Get real man reffs are not Gods.

Anon,

What exactly gives you the right to say anything about the refereeing on any match?

Yes the crowd do it at an NBL or WNBL match but does that make it appropriate?

You mention the frustration of seeing a bad call, well is that any different from the frustration of seeing a player miss an easy lay up? Do you also have the right to yell or offer "well intentioned advice"?

How often do you see a "senior" coach make a mistake by subbing out a player at the wrong time, or running an offence that isn't working? Do you have the right to yell at that coach too?

You are at the match to watch a player play. It's no more approrpiate for you to coach a player from the stands then it is for you to yell at a referee, no matter what your intention is.

You all are missing the point. No one is yelling abuse at a reff (well not me anyway) and the fact that someone calls travel is not directed at any reff in particular. What gives me the right is that I have played, umpired, coached and supported basketball for years. I think we are getting a little precious if we signal out someone from the spectators that has called travel and threaten eviction instead of concentrating on the game and maybe the next time they might get the call right.Coaches and players do not get paid reffs do.

What about you FM?

People,

You are all missing the point.

It is the UIC's that are not doing their jobs. How often do we see them sitting around doing nothing?

If the UIC's were doing their jobs. Then nobody would feel the need to call out becasue they would see it being dealt with.

anon #126212,

Players are performing an open skill. ie somebody is defending them, or might be get close to defend them.

Coaches are making decisions based on possible future occurances.

Umpires are performing a closed skill. No defence, and after the fact. Much easier and less dependent on outside influences.

An umpire mistake IMO is generally due to a lack of understanding due to a lack of training.

Anon #126254,

You've obviously never refereed a game if you think it's an easy job.

Not saying it is easy. Just pointing out that it is easier than playing or coaching.

Refereeing is as you suggest an 'open skill'.

Referees have to deal with:

Perhaps the refs on the other courts aren't up to the standard of the game in question? Especially if it's the highest level game at that timeslot